{vcf-midatlantic] [Semi-OT] 3D Printing Replacement Parts
The limiting factor in all these technologies is more the imagination and skill of the user, and less the technologies themselves. Sure, capabilities grow with time, but incredible things are made every day, with very basic tools.
But I think, vintage computer owners (and reporters, and investors) are spoiled by the revolutionary successes in personal and embedded computing, and carried (past tense) those feelings over to 3D printers and their development and use. This was my essential gripe in the previous discussion. Now, we have dispensed with this issue. People are talking about here-and-now use to make vintage computing parts; reasonable expectations, actual results. Dave McGuire did not post about "incredible things" made, but in fact CREDIBLE things - like that finger splint. He could have used popsickle sticks and string; but his local printer + thingiverse design = useful widget. (shrug) 3D printers may simply become like waffle irons and pancake mix: something you do when needed and ignored soon after. Of course they could do more; like icecream cones. ;)
You can do quite a bit, and in very high quality, if you take the time to properly learn to design parts.
First - 3D printers are pretty sophisticated tools. Better tools do a better job for ANY user. Beginners need a BETTER tool than those with experience. And now, there's better printers on the market (among others), and better resources. In any event, printing toggles is not a big stretch of available technology.
curate a library of 3D printable parts that are directly related to vintage computer systems.
Second - get the plans from someone who has that better experience, better tools. This is what they do in the home-machinist magazines today; they did it in the Pop Science, Pop Mechanics, Pop 'tronics magazines years ago. It was done a century ago in those magazines. 'Fer instance: http://www.retrotechnology.com/restore/boy_mechanic.html
The most notable item is the eject gear for the Apple 3.5" disk drive that has finally been (dare I say it) "perfected."
I know about those eject-mechs, I've sold some as replacements. I see how those gears fail. And I was skeptical about printed gears. This is a real case-in-point and I'm glad Tony Bogan brought it up. Some vintage Macs are close to 40 years old and their plastics are FAILING - repeat, failing. These are real vintage-computing issues. Oh - it's good design to make a part KNOWN TO FAIL. Example - a fuse. Then you can stock and replace only one part, and fix the underlying cause. So I need those gears, and some of those toggles too, and other parts. Some I may have to design, they are uncommon. I'll read this thread with interest and I hope for some collective efforts from it. Even a list of success stories and good printers and CAD tools works for me. Thanks! Herb Johnson plastics are the future -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net
On 03/06/2018 11:43 AM, Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
Dave McGuire did not post about "incredible things" made, but in fact CREDIBLE things - like that finger splint. He could have used popsickle sticks and string; but his local printer + thingiverse design = useful widget. (shrug) 3D printers may simply become like waffle irons and pancake mix: something you do when needed and ignored soon after. Of course they could do more; like icecream cones. ;)
That was very much my point. The printers are are turned on when they're needed, and quickly forgotten about when the task is complete, just like a wrench or a hammer. One other thing that I didn't think of when I typed that last night, which actually illustrates a different point. The thumb splint I made the other day was not the first time I've made that very splint. I screwed up my OTHER thumb last spring, found the splint design on Thingiverse, printed it, used it...and threw it away when I no longer needed it. I needed it again almost a year later, and simply printed another one. In the future, the first one may end up getting recycled and turned back into filament in some way. That would be the obvious next step there. And yes, I could have used popsicle sticks and string, but...I have neither popsicle sticks nor string. :) -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On Mar 6, 2018, at 12:01 PM, Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
And yes, I could have used popsicle sticks and string, but...I have neither popsicle sticks nor string. :)
Well, sure, but that's what spare SIMMs and Cat3 are for. - Dave
On 03/06/2018 12:36 PM, David Riley via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
And yes, I could have used popsicle sticks and string, but...I have neither popsicle sticks nor string. :)
Well, sure, but that's what spare SIMMs and Cat3 are for.
coffee -> keyboard -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On Tue, Mar 6, 2018 at 11:43 AM, Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
Dave McGuire did not post about "incredible things" made, but in fact CREDIBLE things - like that finger splint. He could have used popsickle sticks and string; but his local printer + thingiverse design = useful widget. (shrug) 3D printers may simply become like waffle irons and pancake mix: something you do when needed and ignored soon after. Of course they could do more; like icecream cones. ;)
I don't see how posting about incredible points of fact is useless/impractical versus credible, perhaps you meant being ambitious vs. practical. Because I think it serves to enlighten people about the state of technology available today. At work, where we develop end-to-end motion control systems, one of our many fields involves additive manufacturing, eg. 3D Printing. While Makerbot was hitting the consumer market with their initial foray into 3D printing with their Cupcake 3D Printer over 6 yrs ago, and the open-source 3D Printing group called Rep-Rap was still in it's infancy, we were delivering system capable of printing with biological tissue on the cellular level. Our client was a medical researcher out of Harvard developing 3D Printed Human organs. This includes a complete selection of tissue membranes and vascular structure. And human trials were already successful for the human bladder, and next up are kidneys. You can find his presentation on Ted Talk. This work has already spawned several companies into expanding organ transplants. I'm hoping I can get an employee discount ! Dan -- _ ____ / \__/ Scotty, We Need More Power !! \_/ _\__ Aye, Cap'n, but we've only got 80 columns !!
On 3/6/2018 6:11 PM, Dan Roganti wrote:
Herb Johnson wrote:
Dave McGuire did not post about "incredible things" made, but in fact CREDIBLE things - like that finger splint. He could have used popsickle sticks and string; but his local printer + thingiverse design = useful widget. (shrug) 3D printers may simply become like waffle irons and pancake mix: something you do when needed and ignored soon after. Of course they could do more; like icecream cones. ;)
I don't see how posting about incredible points of fact is useless/impractical versus credible, perhaps you meant being ambitious vs. practical. Because I think it serves to enlighten people about the state of technology available today.
Right. I'm saying that Dave McGuire is saying "I'm doing useful things with my 3D printer, today". If some of them are mundane, that's a working definition of "useful". Waffles are useful.
At work, where we develop end-to-end motion control systems, one of our many fields involves additive manufacturing, eg. 3D Printing. While Makerbot was hitting the consumer market with their initial foray into 3D printing with their Cupcake 3D Printer over 6 yrs ago, and the open-source 3D Printing group called Rep-Rap was still in it's infancy, we were delivering system capable of printing with biological tissue on the cellular level. Our client was a medical researcher out of Harvard developing 3D Printed Human organs.
Dan, thanks for calling out this technology. This is "incredible" when looked at from the past. It's important and potentially useful. But it's not cheap or something you'll do in your basement in 10, 20 years. I think you'll say, this is a multi-million dollars budget, probably tens of millions, to support the lab and the medical staff who "support" this "printer". It's only one part of a much more complicated service. And, I know a little, about commercial 3D printing of serious parts. Aircraft for instance. Same deal - multi-million dollars tools, or at least hundreds of thousands of dollars. Again - we won't print fuel injectors in our basements. The topic is now, printing plastic parts for replacing plastic parts in our vintage computers. herb -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net
participants (4)
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Dan Roganti -
Dave McGuire -
David Riley -
Herb Johnson