VCF East Clinic kudos (soldering iron cleaning brass)
[Regarding brass for soldering iron tip-cleaning.] https://www.testequity.com/category/Electronic-Production-Supplies/Solder-An... This is not "brass wool" which would be an abrasive mesh of dry, sharp fine brass wire. The Hakko product is apparently brass coiled ribbon (my words for it) that is *rosin coated* (fatty acid compound). Other products may have other coatings, or none. A stated virtue of brass over wet sponge is "the tip temperature is not reduced". The virtue of brass is that it's softer than most metals. Of course, melted solder is softer still so it removes excess solder from tips. Since it removes solder, it's likely it will accumulate loose solder splatter. That's likely why it's contained in a bowl or holder, to capture the material. This is all Web homework I did, not stuff I knew previously. Someone with industrial training in soldering, or some reference for that training, may be informative. Regards, Herb Johnson -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net preserve, recover, restore 1970's computing email: hjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT com or try later herbjohnson AT comcast DOT net
On 5/4/22 21:08, Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
This is not "brass wool" which would be an abrasive mesh of dry, sharp fine brass wire. The Hakko product is apparently brass coiled ribbon (my words for it) that is *rosin coated* (fatty acid compound). Other products may have other coatings, or none.
A stated virtue of brass over wet sponge is "the tip temperature is not reduced". The virtue of brass is that it's softer than most metals. Of course, melted solder is softer still so it removes excess solder from tips.
Since it removes solder, it's likely it will accumulate loose solder splatter. That's likely why it's contained in a bowl or holder, to capture the material.
This is all Web homework I did, not stuff I knew previously. Someone with industrial training in soldering, or some reference for that training, may be informative.
"Brass wool" was simply poor choice of terminology. I think we all know what the stuff looks like. This all makes a lot of sense, with the exception of the tip temperature thing. If the tip temperature is affected appreciably by a wipe or two on a sponge, and doesn't recover by the time the iron is moved back to the work, there is something wrong with the iron. In my industrial training in soldering, which admittedly was decades ago, we were told to use wet sponges. But I'd already been soldering for many years before that...using wet sponges with good results. With a wet sponge, the flashing of the water to steam loosens dross/slag and other impurities and allows them to be easily removed by slight friction against the sponge. That said, though, Hakko is a first-rate company that makes real tools for industry, not hobby toys, and they sell those brass coily things. If they didn't work well, Hakko wouldn't be selling them. But I myself have never used one. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
That said, though, Hakko is a first-rate company that makes real tools for industry, not hobby toys, and they sell those brass coily things. If they didn't work well, Hakko wouldn't be selling them.
Yup, that's why I have both kinds on my desk: because it's what the manufacturers recommend :P FWIW I did not use a sponge with my first iron, as a kid. I wiped it against the edge of the wood workbench top, which was made from dimensional lumber. That's apparently how my dad always did it! Thanks, Jonathan
On 5/4/22 21:44, Jonathan Chapman via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
That said, though, Hakko is a first-rate company that makes real tools for industry, not hobby toys, and they sell those brass coily things. If they didn't work well, Hakko wouldn't be selling them.
Yup, that's why I have both kinds on my desk: because it's what the manufacturers recommend :P
:-)
FWIW I did not use a sponge with my first iron, as a kid. I wiped it against the edge of the wood workbench top, which was made from dimensional lumber. That's apparently how my dad always did it!
I don't think I've ever done that, but I've used a wet paper towel in a pinch. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
I have tried the skin on the back of my hand, and my lower arm, and my upper leg. Both sponges and brass wool work better. <wink> - Alex On Wed, May 4, 2022 at 9:50 PM Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org> wrote:
On 5/4/22 21:44, Jonathan Chapman via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
That said, though, Hakko is a first-rate company that makes real tools for industry, not hobby toys, and they sell those brass coily things. If they didn't work well, Hakko wouldn't be selling them.
Yup, that's why I have both kinds on my desk: because it's what the manufacturers recommend :P
:-)
FWIW I did not use a sponge with my first iron, as a kid. I wiped it against the edge of the wood workbench top, which was made from dimensional lumber. That's apparently how my dad always did it!
I don't think I've ever done that, but I've used a wet paper towel in a pinch.
-Dave
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
Mmmm, that great "burnt Alex" smell. ;) -Dave On 5/4/22 22:27, Alexander Jacocks wrote:
I have tried the skin on the back of my hand, and my lower arm, and my upper leg.
Both sponges and brass wool work better.
<wink> - Alex
On Wed, May 4, 2022 at 9:50 PM Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org <mailto:vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org>> wrote:
On 5/4/22 21:44, Jonathan Chapman via vcf-midatlantic wrote: >> That said, though, Hakko is a first-rate company that makes real tools >> for industry, not hobby toys, and they sell those brass coily things. >> If they didn't work well, Hakko wouldn't be selling them. > > Yup, that's why I have both kinds on my desk: because it's what the manufacturers recommend :P
:-)
> FWIW I did not use a sponge with my first iron, as a kid. I wiped it against the edge of the wood workbench top, which was made from dimensional lumber. That's apparently how my dad always did it!
I don't think I've ever done that, but I've used a wet paper towel in a pinch.
-Dave
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
Alex that is hilarious, I had a good laugh! Sent from: My extremely complicated, hand held electronic device.
On May 4, 2022, at 10:26 PM, Alexander Jacocks via vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org> wrote:
I have tried the skin on the back of my hand, and my lower arm, and my upper leg.
Both sponges and brass wool work better.
<wink> - Alex
On Wed, May 4, 2022 at 9:50 PM Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org> wrote:
On 5/4/22 21:44, Jonathan Chapman via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
That said, though, Hakko is a first-rate company that makes real tools for industry, not hobby toys, and they sell those brass coily things. If they didn't work well, Hakko wouldn't be selling them.
Yup, that's why I have both kinds on my desk: because it's what the manufacturers recommend :P
:-)
FWIW I did not use a sponge with my first iron, as a kid. I wiped it against the edge of the wood workbench top, which was made from dimensional lumber. That's apparently how my dad always did it!
I don't think I've ever done that, but I've used a wet paper towel in a pinch.
-Dave
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On 5/4/2022 8:26 PM, Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
On 5/4/22 21:08, Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
Since it removes solder, it's likely it will accumulate loose solder splatter. That's likely why it's contained in a bowl or holder, to capture the material.
I can confirm this. Unless your soldering technique puts so much solder on the tip that dragging it against the brass "ribbon" create a joint enveloping two or more strands, the solder will cool, form a small round blob, and drop through the ribbon to the bottom after a while. Cleaning the ribbon means taking it out of the bowl/tray, dumping the tray, and then massaging the ribbon over a trash can to remove any solder still managed to be inside the ribbon. I'm a huge fan, and it's easier to teach newer soldering students (jab and go, so to speak). Though my Weller (which I take with me to shows, since it's more portable than any of my other units and less horrid if I lose it/it gets stolen) uses a sponge, I just strapped a brass ribbon onto the unit and use that.
In my industrial training in soldering, which admittedly was decades ago, we were told to use wet sponges. But I'd already been soldering for many years before that...using wet sponges with good results. I don't think the wet sponge method is bad, so feel free to keep using it. The brass method is just a bit simpler, and maybe a bit faster (though someone who's used sponge for decades is arguably faster yet). As I noted prior, jabbing into the middle of the ribbon cleans all tip surface in one go, with no need to rotate or otherwise make additional passes (equivalent to a sponge with deep cuts that you can bury the tip into, but some irons don't have deep enough cuts for that.)
I guess I wouldn't get on the "it's better" wagon, but I would defend it as not worse than wet sponge, and it handles my forgetting to wet the sponge workflow better. Jim -- RETRO Innovations, Contemporary Gear for Classic Systems www.go4retro.com store.go4retro.com
I'm a huge fan, and it's easier to teach newer soldering students (jab and go, so to speak). Though my Weller (which I take with me to shows, since it's more portable than any of my other units and less horrid if I lose it/it gets stolen) uses a sponge, I just strapped a brass ribbon onto the unit and use that.
Love the brass stuff. Wet sponge is lame. - Ethan
On 5/5/22 10:24, Ethan O'Toole via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
I'm a huge fan, and it's easier to teach newer soldering students (jab and go, so to speak). Though my Weller (which I take with me to shows, since it's more portable than any of my other units and less horrid if I lose it/it gets stolen) uses a sponge, I just strapped a brass ribbon onto the unit and use that.
Love the brass stuff. Wet sponge is lame.
Wet sponge has worked great for me since the 1970s. However, given these positive comments from people whose opinions I value, I will give brass stuff a try. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
We'll just call the use of the brass stuff, "dry cleaning" :) On Thu, May 5, 2022 at 10:33 AM Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org> wrote:
Wet sponge has worked great for me since the 1970s.
However, given these positive comments from people whose opinions I value, I will give brass stuff a try.
Yes. :) On 5/5/22 11:05, Jeff S via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
We'll just call the use of the brass stuff, "dry cleaning" :)
On Thu, May 5, 2022 at 10:33 AM Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org> wrote:
Wet sponge has worked great for me since the 1970s.
However, given these positive comments from people whose opinions I value, I will give brass stuff a try.
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
Hello! Chiming in with my loose change here, (and griping that I missed the activity in the CDL space this year), I normally use a cheap wash cloth for wiping off my soldering iron. The only time I used any of the methods was in tech school a heck of a long time ago. I as well had been using such tools far longer then a lot of them there. Oh and Dave please ignore the newly arrived group, that's the one wearing maroon ball caps with out a logo. ----- Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@gmail.com "This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again." On Thu, May 5, 2022 at 11:37 AM Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org> wrote:
Yes. :)
On 5/5/22 11:05, Jeff S via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
We'll just call the use of the brass stuff, "dry cleaning" :)
On Thu, May 5, 2022 at 10:33 AM Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org> wrote:
Wet sponge has worked great for me since the 1970s.
However, given these positive comments from people whose opinions I value, I will give brass stuff a try.
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
I also use this stuff. I LOVE it. Spent my youth using wet sponges. With this wirey stuff, no burned sponges. And I've used the same one for a few years. I just keep emptying out the bottom of the holder. Eventually you do need to replace it, but I find it lasts a LONG time. Much longer than a sponge. I also agree that it places much less thermal load on the iron than a wet sponge. When working on very fine solder joints, and using a low power iron for it, with a thin tip, the thermal mass of the iron is very small and easily overcome with rapid water cooling. No such issue with the brillo/brass colored curly stuff. With a sponge, you need to wipe the tip across the sponge, sometimes twice (bottom side of tip, top side of tip). With the curly stuff just shove it in and take it out. The curly-cues will surround the tip and clean it off. I'll never go back to a) wet sponges b) solder wicks/suckers. I'll stick with a) curly stuff b) a proper desoldering iron 73 Eugene W2HX Subscribe to my Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/w2hx-channel/videos -----Original Message----- From: vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic-bounces@lists.vcfed.org> On Behalf Of Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic Sent: Wednesday, May 4, 2022 9:08 PM To: vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org> Cc: Herb Johnson <hjohnson@retrotechnology.info> Subject: [vcf-midatlantic] VCF East Clinic kudos (soldering iron cleaning brass) [Regarding brass for soldering iron tip-cleaning.] https://www.testequity.com/category/Electronic-Production-Supplies/Solder-An... This is not "brass wool" which would be an abrasive mesh of dry, sharp fine brass wire. The Hakko product is apparently brass coiled ribbon (my words for it) that is *rosin coated* (fatty acid compound). Other products may have other coatings, or none. A stated virtue of brass over wet sponge is "the tip temperature is not reduced". The virtue of brass is that it's softer than most metals. Of course, melted solder is softer still so it removes excess solder from tips. Since it removes solder, it's likely it will accumulate loose solder splatter. That's likely why it's contained in a bowl or holder, to capture the material. This is all Web homework I did, not stuff I knew previously. Someone with industrial training in soldering, or some reference for that training, may be informative. Regards, Herb Johnson -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net preserve, recover, restore 1970's computing email: hjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT com or try later herbjohnson AT comcast DOT net
participants (10)
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Alexander Jacocks -
Dave McGuire -
Ethan O'Toole -
Gregg Levine -
Herb Johnson -
Jeff S -
Jonathan Chapman -
RETRO Innovations -
Sentrytv -
W2HX