looking for intel 4040 programs
So far the only [4040 programs] I know of are Herb Johnson's stuff at http://www.retrotechnology.com/restore/intel440_roms.html
You're welcome. Also consider http://www.retrotechnology.com/restore/int_upp.html which describes the Intel UPP programmers, operated by a 4040. Their code is locked up in 4001's. They are operated by an Intel 8-bit system. http://www.retrotechnology.com/restore/a04.html A simple cross assembler. Pro-log's "The Designer's Guide to Programmed Logic" has how-to-code 4040 examples. I have copies from two years, 1972 and 1977. Copies are available for a modest fee. Yes, I charge fees. MOst use of 4004 and 4040, were in products for industry. The sources were never released for those. Disassembly is informative. The 4004 and 4040 were controllers and so most any code was special purpose. I suppose, you could try to find old Intel user archives - they had a small collection of 4-bit and 8-bit programs as part of their User Library. Many of Intel's eight-bit and 16-bit programs have been recovered in the last few years. But Intel lost interest in their 4-bit development products by the Multibus era. What's your plan? Herb -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net
Evan wrote:
> Let's use the "Semi-OT" subject line prefix for posts about > microcontrollers.
Dan Roganti wrote:
I guess he means the new stuff, microcontrollers can be vintage too they never get any love eg, i8051/31
Dave McGuire wrote:
I hadn't seen any discussion of any other microcontrollers recently, new or old.
I have the advantage, of reading this list on the Web. It appears Evan was responding to the "looking for Intel 4040 programs" thread, and after my (Herb Johnson's) post in particular. I discussed the somewhat "industrial" heritage of Intel 4040-based software, see that thread. Evan is the moderator and is charge of this list. I'll obey his request. However, Evan sometimes insists that microprocessor products which served as industrial development tools or applications, aren't really, er, whatever he is calling "vintage computers". That's an interesting point of view, as some of these products PRECEEDED "personal computing", and some of theme contributed to "personal computing". And some people from the "controller" world became part of the "personal computing" world. The KIM and many other early single-board microcomputers of the late 70's, were both "industrial" and "personal". They were sold to engineers, college students, etc. to promote use of their associated microprocessor. Some were used in small-run commercial products. Some ran industrial processes. Some were used by scientists for research. But they also were sold by electronic parts distributors to individuals (at the time, techies for the most part), or even sold directly by the microprocessor manufacturers to individuals. After all - there weren't any personal computers yet. Or personal computing, as we think of such things in the 21st century - pretty products, stores. It had to start somewhere, y' know. The same magazine-ad parts distributors of the 1970's, companies which sold S-100 boards and systems - are they "microcontrollers" too, Evan? - also sold KIMs and Motorola D2's (6800 single boards) and ELF's (COSMAC 1802-based single boards). Now unfamiliar microprocessors (Pace, F8, etc.) were also part of manufacturer's single-board kits. There were many hobby groups, and group-distributed paper newsletters (pre-Internet), devoted to these single-board microcomputers. That was the face of "personal computing" in the early and mid-1970's: the era of the Intel 4004 and 4040. Now, I'll grant there were few Intel 4040 single-boards, except from Intel and Pro-Log. As I posted, most use of the 4040 was "industrial". (Of course there were 4004 or 4040 calculators.) The very earliest somewhat-personal microprocessor-based "micro-computers" were mostly 8-bit, the 8008 et. al. But, many old 4040 and 4004 systems have since fallen into hobby hands. I exhibited some myself (with Kyle Owen) a few years ago at VCF-East. There's been recent good work, to revive Intel's 8-bit (and some 16-bit) development software on Multibus - an industrial board bus. But some early Sun and SGI computers were Multibus; interests in those brands is certainly part of "vintage computing". Also: Any number of tech people with "industrial" microprocessor background, became involved with early personal computing companies, contributed to personal computing development. Some guy named Kildall, did early work for Intel on 8008 and 8080 software. I heard he came up with some MS-DOS like operating system....See-Pee-Em, something like that....? Vintage computing history, isn't a straight line from chip-makers to Apple and IBM at the mall. Not all personal computers had custom-designed cabinets for the living room. Some vintage computers were big, before they were small. Or ugly boards of chips. And some old-people who worked on them, ain't dead yet. I would suggest that early "microcontrollers" are on topic here. Herb Johnson retrotechnology.com -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net preserve, recover, restore 1970's computing email: hjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT com or try later herbjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT info
On 06/29/2017 12:12 PM, Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic wrote: ...
I would suggest that early "microcontrollers" are on topic here.
<aol> Me too. </aol> The microcontroller is a special case of the microprocessor. They're computers too. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 12:25 PM, Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
On 06/29/2017 12:12 PM, Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic wrote: ...
I would suggest that early "microcontrollers" are on topic here.
<aol> Me too. </aol>
The microcontroller is a special case of the microprocessor. They're computers too.
-Dave
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
I recall the TMS1000 was the first one in 1974, and its many variants thru the 70s and 80s, but they called it a microcomputer. I guess the term microcontroller came a few years later. But it combined all the essential components on one die, processor, ram, rom, and some had LED or VFD display ports. Not only did they find their way into calculators, but also the first generation of computerized board games and robotic toys in the 1970s, Code Name Sector and Big Trak. I think Intel didn't get onboard the microcontroller scene until 1980 with the 8051/31 But I could be mistaken. Dan -- _ ____ / \__/ Scotty, We Need More Power !! \_/ _\__ Aye, Cap'n, but we've only got 80 col's !!
On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 12:47 PM, Dan Roganti <ragooman@gmail.com> wrote:
On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 12:25 PM, Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
On 06/29/2017 12:12 PM, Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic wrote: ...
I would suggest that early "microcontrollers" are on topic here.
<aol> Me too. </aol>
The microcontroller is a special case of the microprocessor. They're computers too.
-Dave
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
I recall the TMS1000 was the first one in 1974, and its many variants thru the 70s and 80s, but they called it a microcomputer. I guess the term microcontroller came a few years later. But it combined all the essential components on one die, processor, ram, rom, and some had LED or VFD display ports. Not only did they find their way into calculators, but also the first generation of computerized board games and robotic toys in the 1970s, Code Name Sector and Big Trak. I think Intel didn't get onboard the microcontroller scene until 1980 with the 8051/31 But I could be mistaken. Dan
-
ohh, I remember now, of course Intel had the 8049 microcontroller in the 70s Dan -- _ ____ / \__/ Scotty, We Need More Power !! \_/ _\__ Aye, Cap'n, but we've only got 80 col's !!
On 06/29/2017 12:54 PM, Dan Roganti wrote:
I recall the TMS1000 was the first one in 1974, and its many variants thru the 70s and 80s, but they called it a microcomputer. I guess the term microcontroller came a few years later. But it combined all the essential components on one die, processor, ram, rom, and some had LED or VFD display ports. Not only did they find their way into calculators, but also the first generation of computerized board games and robotic toys in the 1970s, Code Name Sector and Big Trak. I think Intel didn't get onboard the microcontroller scene until 1980 with the 8051/31 But I could be mistaken.
ohh, I remember now, of course Intel had the 8049 microcontroller in the 70s
Yeah 8049 is a nice little processor. I have development tools for it, at least a cross assembler and some other stuff. I also have lots and lots (AND LOTS...probably 100+) of 8749s, the EPROM version, if you (or anyone else) wants to hack on some. I'm not purging them, but I have more of them than I will ever need and they're really nice chips. I've read about the TMS1000 and have seen it in lots of places. I've always bee interested in learning more about it but I think they were only ever sold in mask-programmed versions. That makes me wonder what was done for development. It may not have been EPROM, sure, it was pretty early for that...but surely something was done before going all the way to a mask. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
Absolutely agree that old "microcontrollers" are relevant. I'm sure a bunch of us could list off at least a dozen CPUs that were used in the capacity that microcontrollers are now, not to mention even vintage devices we'd definitely recognize as microcontrollers today (Mostek's single-chip F8 with piggyback ROM, or the already mentioned 8051 and 8048). Further, there are some interesting microcontrollers available now that are in fact vintage (or almost-vintage) CPU cores at their hearts. In particular I'm thinking of the Microchip PIC32 line, which is a MIPS32 core. Thanks, Jonathan On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 12:25 PM, Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
On 06/29/2017 12:12 PM, Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic wrote: ...
I would suggest that early "microcontrollers" are on topic here.
<aol> Me too. </aol>
The microcontroller is a special case of the microprocessor. They're computers too.
-Dave
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 1:30 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
Absolutely agree that old "microcontrollers" are relevant.
Old ones, yes. When I posted that microcontroller discussion should be semi-OT I meant the new ones.
I really don't think they even use that phrase any longer for the new stuff, eg Raspberry PI, et al I think only for the Arduino style boards since its still an 8bitter, but even the newer Arduino boards are 32bit processors now They are more apt to refer them as SoC's in regard to the new Processors Because of their complexity, either 32bits or 64bits cpu, and a Buttload of I/O interfaces And so they are regarded more as a Embedded controller, even though it's a old term, indicating their advanced complexity. Dan -- _ ____ / \__/ Scotty, We Need More Power !! \_/ _\__ Aye, Cap'n, but we've only got 80 col's !!
On 06/29/2017 01:37 PM, Dan Roganti via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
Absolutely agree that old "microcontrollers" are relevant.
Old ones, yes. When I posted that microcontroller discussion should be semi-OT I meant the new ones.
I really don't think they even use that phrase any longer for the new stuff, eg Raspberry PI, et al I think only for the Arduino style boards since its still an 8bitter, but even the newer Arduino boards are 32bit processors now They are more apt to refer them as SoC's in regard to the new Processors Because of their complexity, either 32bits or 64bits cpu, and a Buttload of I/O interfaces And so they are regarded more as a Embedded controller, even though it's a old term, indicating their advanced complexity.
This is dangerous territory. There are plenty of absolutely current processors which just happen to be 8-bit architectures. 8-bits doesn't imply anything at all about age. (I know YOU know this, this is mainly for the benefit of folks here who might be stuck on certain assumptions) And I sincerely hope nobody here actually considers RPi to be a "microcontroller"...with its video, keyboard/mouse interface, network interface... Wow. ;) There are a lot of gray areas and certainly quite a bit of overlap. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
And I sincerely hope nobody here actually considers RPi to be a "microcontroller"...with its video, keyboard/mouse interface, network interface... Wow. ;)
Regardless: it's not vintage, thus any discussion of it should be OT: except when directly related to some clear vintage computing topic.
On 06/29/2017 01:48 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
And I sincerely hope nobody here actually considers RPi to be a "microcontroller"...with its video, keyboard/mouse interface, network interface... Wow. ;)
Regardless: it's not vintage, thus any discussion of it should be OT: except when directly related to some clear vintage computing topic.
Of course, and we heard you the first time. ;) But discussion of how to determine what is or is not vintage seems rather on-topic to me. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 1:48 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
And I sincerely hope nobody here actually considers RPi to be a
"microcontroller"...with its video, keyboard/mouse interface, network interface... Wow. ;)
Regardless: it's not vintage, thus any discussion of it should be OT: except when directly related to some clear vintage computing topic.
you don't get to say the word regardless, unless you first build the obligatory "Hello World" style project everyone here builds called "Blink The LED" on your new RPi Zero ;)
On 06/29/2017 01:51 PM, Dan Roganti via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
And I sincerely hope nobody here actually considers RPi to be a
"microcontroller"...with its video, keyboard/mouse interface, network interface... Wow. ;)
Regardless: it's not vintage, thus any discussion of it should be OT: except when directly related to some clear vintage computing topic.
you don't get to say the word regardless, unless you first build the obligatory "Hello World" style project everyone here builds called "Blink The LED" on your new RPi Zero ;)
soda -> keyboard I hereby declare today to be Pick On Evan Day. HEY EVAN! You ugly and yo mutha dresses you funny! ;) -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On 06/29/2017 01:57 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
I hereby declare today to be Pick On Evan Day. HEY EVAN! You ugly and yo mutha dresses you funny! ;)
Bring it on. Plenty of good material here.
Hey, what's that glare? Oh, it's the sun reflecting from Evan's head! B-)
Just be prepared for the revenge. :)
Uh-oh. 8-| -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 1:57 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
I hereby declare today to be Pick On Evan Day. HEY EVAN! You ugly
and yo mutha dresses you funny! ;)
Bring it on. Plenty of good material here.
Just be prepared for the revenge. :)
I can wait till the net VCF prank ;) -- _ ____ / \__/ Scotty, We Need More Power !! \_/ _\__ Aye, Cap'n, but we've only got 80 col's !!
On 06/29/2017 02:02 PM, Dan Roganti via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
I hereby declare today to be Pick On Evan Day. HEY EVAN! You ugly
and yo mutha dresses you funny! ;)
Bring it on. Plenty of good material here.
Just be prepared for the revenge. :)
I can wait till the net VCF prank ;)
Muahahaha!! B-) -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On 6/29/2017 1:51 PM, Dan Roganti via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 1:48 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
And I sincerely hope nobody here actually considers RPi to be a
"microcontroller"...with its video, keyboard/mouse interface, network interface... Wow. ;)
Regardless: it's not vintage, thus any discussion of it should be OT: except when directly related to some clear vintage computing topic.
you don't get to say the word regardless, unless you first build the obligatory "Hello World" style project everyone here builds called "Blink The LED" on your new RPi Zero ;) Dave M must be mad as a hornet that Evan can get a RPi Zero and he can't! :)
On 06/29/2017 02:05 PM, Douglas Crawford via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
you don't get to say the word regardless, unless you first build the obligatory "Hello World" style project everyone here builds called "Blink The LED" on your new RPi Zero ;) Dave M must be mad as a hornet that Evan can get a RPi Zero and he can't! :)
The thought had crossed my mind. ;) I can probably get ONE...trouble is, I do lots of things with little boards like this, so I want to standardize on them. Which means I want twenty. Not one. :-/ -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
you don't get to say the word regardless, unless you first build the obligatory "Hello World" style project everyone here builds called "Blink The LED" on your new RPi Zero ;)
Okay you win! Simple instructions: https://www.tunnelsup.com/raspberry-pi-zero-blink-an-led-using-gpio-pins/ Looks easy enough. First I have to put Linux onto the microcon... errr SBC. Serious question: how do I decide what LED and what resistor to use? Second less-serious question: I can type in the few lines from the project page, but I do not have the time/interest to learn Python. How can I interface the Pi to my Apple II :) and do things in BASIC?
How can I interface the Pi to my Apple II :) and do things in BASIC?
And..... I Googled: http://ivanx.com/appleii/rasppleii/ http://schmenk.is-a-geek.com/wordpress/?p=167 ________________________________ Evan Koblentz, director Vintage Computer Federation a 501(c)(3) educational non-profit evan@vcfed.org (646) 546-9999 www.vcfed.org facebook.com/vcfederation twitter.com/vcfederation instagram.com/vcfederation
Whoa cool: https://www.ultimateapple2.com/catalogzen155a/index.php?main_page=product_in... I think I need this.
On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 2:37 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
you don't get to say the word regardless, unless you first build the
obligatory "Hello World" style project everyone here builds called "Blink The LED" on your new RPi Zero ;)
Okay you win!
Simple instructions: https://www.tunnelsup.com/rasp berry-pi-zero-blink-an-led-using-gpio-pins/
Looks easy enough.
First I have to put Linux onto the microcon... errr SBC.
Serious question: how do I decide what LED and what resistor to use?
any generic LED will do, just hit up the Radio Shack, of dig one up at Infoage IXR That website you posted should have listed the resistor value, but from the color code it's another common value, 330ohms, probably also found at IXR
Second less-serious question: I can type in the few lines from the project page, but I do not have the time/interest to learn Python. How can I interface the Pi to my Apple II :) and do things in BASIC?
DON'T DO IT IN BASIC unless you like to suffer the wrath of your cohorts here use your google foo to look python tutorial -- _ ____ / \__/ Scotty, We Need More Power !! \_/ _\__ Aye, Cap'n, but we've only got 80 col's !!
any generic LED will do, just hit up the Radio Shack, of dig one up at Infoage IXR > That website you posted should have listed the resistor value, but from the color code it's another common value, 330ohms, probably also found at IXR
Thanks. I will be there Saturday.
use your google foo to look python tutorial
:) Maybe... Found a 16GB microSD and a microSD <> USB adapter in the pile of crap that I call a home workbench. Going to put Linux on it. Do I use an .iso just like with a DVD?
Computer doesn't like the card. Same problem in two other computers. Dead card or fixable? https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5thK4McllfJdThkRldjLVY1bW8
Whoa cool: https://www.ultimateapple2.com/catalogzen155a/index.php?main _page=product_info&cPath=1_31&products_id=126 I think I need this.
Or connect the Pi's Rx and Tx serial lines to your SSC. It's the same thing. :-) Henry S. Courbis Office Toll Free: (800) REACTIVE (732-2848) Office/Mobile Direct: (856) 779-1900 www.ReActiveMicro.com <http://www.ReactiveMicro.com> - Sales, Support, and News, Our Headquarters on the Internet ReActiveMicro.com/wiki - Support, Software, Manuals, and History. Create your own page today! Facebook.com/reactivemicrousa - Our Social Media Outlet and Support On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 3:35 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
Please tell me you didn't buy into the myth that the only language that
you can a RPi is Python!
Nope. It just happened to be recommended in the first result when I Googled for "Pi blink LED project" or whatever.
Why not use the Rasp Pi to power your PiDP8 with simH OS/8, and with an RS232 converter attach to the teletype? You'd need to step down the baud. I guess you could also dedicate a Pi to just the step down part. You'd have to play around with what works best and how the Pi fits into the mix. On Fri, Jun 30, 2017 at 2:28 PM, Support via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
Whoa cool: https://www.ultimateapple2.com/catalogzen155a/index.php?main _page=product_info&cPath=1_31&products_id=126 I think I need this.
Or connect the Pi's Rx and Tx serial lines to your SSC. It's the same thing. :-)
Henry S. Courbis
Office Toll Free: (800) REACTIVE (732-2848) Office/Mobile Direct: (856) 779-1900 www.ReActiveMicro.com <http://www.ReactiveMicro.com> - Sales, Support, and News, Our Headquarters on the Internet ReActiveMicro.com/wiki - Support, Software, Manuals, and History. Create your own page today! Facebook.com/reactivemicrousa - Our Social Media Outlet and Support
On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 3:35 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote:
Please tell me you didn't buy into the myth that the only language that
you can a RPi is Python!
Nope. It just happened to be recommended in the first result when I Googled for "Pi blink LED project" or whatever.
On 06/29/2017 03:45 PM, - - wrote:
This is dangerous territory. There are plenty of absolutely current processors which just happen to be 8-bit architectures. 8-bits doesn't imply anything at all about age. (I know YOU know this, this is mainly for the benefit of folks here who might be stuck on certain assumptions)
And I sincerely hope nobody here actually considers RPi to be a "microcontroller"...with its video, keyboard/mouse interface, network interface... Wow. ;)
There are a lot of gray areas and certainly quite a bit of overlap.
8035/8047/8051 Familes - Microcontroller (love the 8052, a ton of RAM at 256Bs!)
No argument here.
8018x - Microcontroller
There are full-blown MS-DOS PCs built around these.
Z180 - Microcontroller (my Circuit Cellar/Micromint boards run on these)
There are full-blown CP/M desktop systems built around these.
Z8 - Microcontroller (I think)
Yes.
6800 - Microprocessor (no internal RAM/ROM) 6802 - Microcontroller (? has RAM, no ROM) 6807 - Microcontroller (I have one with a piggy back for EPROM) 68HC11 - Microcontroller (I have the A0 which has the ROM disabled) AVRs - Microcontrollers
No argument.
PIC32 - Microcontroller (well that's what they're call by Microchip though some could be SoC)
...until you put UNIX on one, which has been done.
ARM - Oh I give up ;-). Many are Microcontrollers but since ARM is licensed IP and not hardware it's up to the manufacturer.
So as I said, gray areas. For several of them, I think whether or not it's reasonable to consider it a microcontroller may be based on its use in a given application. Z80s are used in plenty of embedded applications. The metric that I usually use (as an embedded systems designer) is whether or not it has on-chip RAM and ROM. But then some of the microcontrollers I use don't, so.. Much like the "firsts", we're splitting hairs and trying to rigidly define something that's fairly fluid. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
On Thu, 29 Jun 2017, Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
On 06/29/2017 03:45 PM, - - wrote:
There are a lot of gray areas and certainly quite a bit of overlap.
Absolutely. You could define some arbitrary lines here, but why?
8018x - Microcontroller
There are full-blown MS-DOS PCs built around these.
Some (all?) IBM Xstations (sold alongside RS/6000 installs) were 80186 - not exactly high performance workstations, but I think the only place I've personally seen a '186 in the wild. I trash-picked older RS/6000s to replace these rather terrible machines. ;)
68HC11 - Microcontroller (I have the A0 which has the ROM disabled)
Glad this got mentioned only because it is still a favorite of mine. Maybe I'll try to hack a bus together between a Raspberry Pi, my SYM-1, and one of my 68HC11 EVBs. </troll> -- Jameel Akari
On 06/29/2017 01:27 PM, systems_glitch via vcf-midatlantic wrote:
Further, there are some interesting microcontrollers available now that are in fact vintage (or almost-vintage) CPU cores at their hearts. In particular I'm thinking of the Microchip PIC32 line, which is a MIPS32 core.
Good thinking there, but it's from 1985, no more vintage than ARM (also 1985) and a whole lot newer than x86 (1978). IMO, thinking of architectures as vintage is probably fallacy. Implementations, sure, but architectures? Lots of processors we'd never consider "vintage" today (ARM is a good example) are implementations of architectures that are decades old. This is sorta necessary, as it takes time, lots of time (as you know) for software to catch up. Only in the past 5-6 years or so have the GCC back-ends started generating really good code for ARM, for example. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
participants (10)
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Dan Roganti -
Dave McGuire -
Douglas Crawford -
Evan Koblentz -
Herb Johnson -
Jameel Akari -
Support -
systems_glitch -
william degnan