- vcf-midatlantic - lists.vcfed.org

Museum shout out
by Tony Bogan 11 Mar '18

11 Mar '18

Been here at the museum since 10:30 working on tagging and fixing apple IIs from the warehouse and other jobs. Will be docent here all day if anyone has nothing to do over the next 5 1/2 hours feel free to stop by!! :-) Tony Sent from my iPhone

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OT: Mechanical Computer with Marbles
by Joseph Oprysko 10 Mar '18

10 Mar '18

I read a post elsewhere and heard that there’s also a YouTube video (but I haven’t watched it) of this rather cool looking device called Turing Tumble. Apparently it is a Kickstarter funded mechanical computer made of plastic and marbles. It kind of reminds me of the Digicomp II mechanical computer from the late 1960’s. https://www.turingtumble.com/ -- Normal Person: Hey, it seems that you know a lot. Geek: To be honest, it's due to all the surfing I do. Normal Person: So you go surfing? Normal Person: But I don't think that has anything to do with knowing a lot... Geek: I think that's wrong on a fundamental level. Normal Person: Huh? Huh? What?

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Tomorrow @ Liberty Science Center
by Evan Koblentz 10 Mar '18

10 Mar '18

I'll be at the Liberty Science Center (Jersey City, NJ) all day tomorrow demonstrating the 1987 Lego robotics kit with our Laser 128. It's as much fun for me as for kids! Feel free to come visit! Random idea: one of these days I should disassemble the forklift-style robot and make something evoking Johnny No. 5 instead. :) #nodisassemble #evanalive

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{vcf-midatlantic] [Semi-OT] 3D Printing Replacement Parts
by Herb Johnson 09 Mar '18

09 Mar '18

> The limiting factor in all these technologies is more the > imagination and skill of the user, and less the technologies > themselves. Sure, capabilities grow with time, but incredible > things are made every day, with very basic tools. But I think, vintage computer owners (and reporters, and investors) are spoiled by the revolutionary successes in personal and embedded computing, and carried (past tense) those feelings over to 3D printers and their development and use. This was my essential gripe in the previous discussion. Now, we have dispensed with this issue. People are talking about here-and-now use to make vintage computing parts; reasonable expectations, actual results. Dave McGuire did not post about "incredible things" made, but in fact CREDIBLE things - like that finger splint. He could have used popsickle sticks and string; but his local printer + thingiverse design = useful widget. (shrug) 3D printers may simply become like waffle irons and pancake mix: something you do when needed and ignored soon after. Of course they could do more; like icecream cones. ;) > You can do quite a bit, and in very high quality, if you take > the time to properly learn to design parts. First - 3D printers are pretty sophisticated tools. Better tools do a better job for ANY user. Beginners need a BETTER tool than those with experience. And now, there's better printers on the market (among others), and better resources. In any event, printing toggles is not a big stretch of available technology. > curate a library of 3D printable parts that are > directly related to vintage computer systems. Second - get the plans from someone who has that better experience, better tools. This is what they do in the home-machinist magazines today; they did it in the Pop Science, Pop Mechanics, Pop 'tronics magazines years ago. It was done a century ago in those magazines. 'Fer instance: http://www.retrotechnology.com/restore/boy_mechanic.html > The most notable item is the eject gear for the Apple 3.5" disk > drive that has finally been (dare I say it) "perfected." I know about those eject-mechs, I've sold some as replacements. I see how those gears fail. And I was skeptical about printed gears. This is a real case-in-point and I'm glad Tony Bogan brought it up. Some vintage Macs are close to 40 years old and their plastics are FAILING - repeat, failing. These are real vintage-computing issues. Oh - it's good design to make a part KNOWN TO FAIL. Example - a fuse. Then you can stock and replace only one part, and fix the underlying cause. So I need those gears, and some of those toggles too, and other parts. Some I may have to design, they are uncommon. I'll read this thread with interest and I hope for some collective efforts from it. Even a list of success stories and good printers and CAD tools works for me. Thanks! Herb Johnson plastics are the future -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net

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Printing on 14" greenbar
by Evan Koblentz 08 Mar '18

08 Mar '18

Who in the group has (any) computer + printer that is ready-to-go for printing on 14" greenbar? This is for a VCFed collaboration opportunity with another organization (I can't elaborate right now).

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] Printing on 14" greenbar
by VAXman＠tmesis.org 07 Mar '18

07 Mar '18

Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic writes: > Well I suppose that depends on the (unstated) intent. The printers >won't be leaving LSSM, but we are happy to print stuff for >people/projects/etc. They might need a really freakin' long BC22D! :P

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] Printing on 14" greenbar
by VAXman＠tmesis.org 07 Mar '18

07 Mar '18

Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic writes: >On 03/07/2018 04:23 PM, Brian Schenkenberger via vcf-midatlantic wrote: >>> On 03/07/2018 03:22 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic wrote: > >Who >> in the group has (any) computer + printer that is ready-to-go for >> >> printing on 14" greenbar? This is for a VCFed collaboration >opportunity >>> with another organization (I can't elaborate right now). >>> >> We have several in operable condition over at LSSM. > > LOL! > > ? My guess is he's not going to trek to P'burgh to get one! ;) I DO have a working DEC LA-120 DEcwriter and a large box of greenbar fan-fold; albeit, I never print on its greenbar side. I hate loooking at it.

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] Printing on 14" greenbar
by VAXman＠tmesis.org 07 Mar '18

07 Mar '18

Dave McGuire via vcf-midatlantic writes: >On 03/07/2018 03:22 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic wrote: > Who >in the group has (any) computer + printer that is ready-to-go for > >printing on 14" greenbar? This is for a VCFed collaboration opportunity >> with another organization (I can't elaborate right now). > > We have several in operable condition over at LSSM. LOL!

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] Printing on 14" greenbar
by VAXman＠tmesis.org 07 Mar '18

07 Mar '18

Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic writes: >Who in the group has (any) computer + printer that is ready-to-go for >printing on 14" greenbar? This is for a VCFed collaboration opportunity >with another organization (I can't elaborate right now). Like, perhaps, an LA-120 DECwriter???

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] Need to change April workshop date
by Bill Degnan 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

note that's VCF SE's weekend. On Tue, Mar 6, 2018 at 2:42 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Evan Koblentz <evan(a)vcfed.org> > To: vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> > Cc: > Bcc: > Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2018 14:42:14 -0500 > Subject: Need to change April workshop date > A bunch of Sandy volunteers (yes it's still happening) need to use the > barracks area April 7-8. That bumps us. (Don't worry, it's set in stone for > VCF East weekend.) > > They said we could reschedule to April 21-22 or 28-29. > > Vote here: https://doodle.com/poll/vyyvb324ah8i8bvw ... whichever date > has the most votes by 11:59pm this Thursday wins. > > Votes via reply to this message will not be counted. > >

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Need to change April workshop date
by Evan Koblentz 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

A bunch of Sandy volunteers (yes it's still happening) need to use the barracks area April 7-8. That bumps us. (Don't worry, it's set in stone for VCF East weekend.) They said we could reschedule to April 21-22 or 28-29. Vote here: https://doodle.com/poll/vyyvb324ah8i8bvw ... whichever date has the most votes by 11:59pm this Thursday wins. Votes via reply to this message will not be counted.

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Correct link for April 7-8 workshop
by Evan Koblentz 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

Corrected link: https://tinyurl.com/yam5mnpc On Mar 6, 2018 11:06 AM, "corey cohen via vcf-midatlantic" < vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: I’ll be Sunday at some point. Maybe Saturday night also if my family is tired of me since my kids are off all the previous week from school. corey cohen uǝɥoɔ ʎǝɹoɔ > On Mar 6, 2018, at 10:39 AM, J. Alexander Jacocks via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: > > Confirmed. > > - Alex > > On Tue, Mar 6, 2018 at 10:37 AM, Dean Notarnicola via vcf-midatlantic < > vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: > >> Same here. Regenerate the tiny url. >> >> On Tue, Mar 6, 2018 at 10:34 AM Jeff Galinat via vcf-midatlantic < >> vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: >> >>> On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 10:58 PM Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic < >>> vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: >>> >>>> Here's the signup sheet for the April 7-8 workshop: >>>> http://tinyurl.com/yd3mxfsu >>>> >>> Hi Evan, >>> That link does not seem to work for me. I clicked and/or copied it in >> both >>> Safari & Chrome and it just brought me to the default Google Search page. >>> It might just be a problem on my end so I wanted to see if others have >>> problems with it. >>> Regards, >>> Jeff >>> >>

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] Connor's famous (again)
by Brian L. Stuart 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

On Tue, 3/6/18, Connor Krukosky via vcf-midatlantic <vcfmidatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: > Wow, yup, I need to go to bed, thought I sent it to JUST Evan and... > Welp, here I am spamming the list now (rolls eyes) > Yup I'm still human guys. Don't worry, still making just as many > mistakes as I always have haha. Don't think it got to > my head too much yet, though maybe it has a little... Some of > you keep me in my place sometimes, and thanks ;) > (Looking at you Ian haha) Connor, Staying grounded is certainly a good thing, but at the same time, you're on an incredible adventure that I suspect more than a few of us envy. And it may well be the only time in history that ignoring Dave's sage advice worked out. :) I think it's safe to say we're all proud of you and look forward to seeing you at VCF. For that matter, I'd like to see you give a keynote at a VCF sometime where you tell us all about this adventure. BLS

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] East XIII exhibit registration is open!
by Evan Koblentz 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

>> is their advanced tickets via paypal too ? or just wait till that wknd ? There will be. It's not ready. On Mar 6, 2018 12:18 PM, "Dan Roganti" <ragooman(a)gmail.com> wrote: is their advanced tickets via paypal too ? or just wait till that wknd ? Dan

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East XIII exhibit registration is open!
by Evan Koblentz 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

Aaaaaaaand ..... go! http://vcfed.org/wp/festivals/vintage-computer-festival-east/vcf-east-exhib…

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Sign up: April 7-8 workshop
by Evan Koblentz 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

Here's the signup sheet for the April 7-8 workshop: http://tinyurl.com/yd3mxfsu

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[Semi-OT] 3D Printing Replacement Parts (Was: Re: About Bill's message)
by J. Alexander Jacocks 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

A concrete item that you can see today is the power switch on the IBM PS/2 Model 76, in the museum. It was broken at some point in the past, and I 3D printed a replacement. One way that you can deal with the limited number of colors available in PLA/PET/ABS filament is to dye the results. For an example, see this article in Make <https://makezine.com/2013/05/09/how-to-dye-your-3d-prints/> magazine. You can do quite a bit, and in very high quality, if you take the time to properly learn to design parts. All the things that are required for the design of professionally made injection-molded parts (clearance, tolerance, wear, etc.) are also necessary to get a good quality result out of FDM. And, of course, there is SLA, if you really need fine detail. And last, there are those, like myself, who also tinker in the subtractive manufacturing arena that is CNC machining. That produces quite a bit more robust parts, from any machinable material, including ferrous metals. The limiting factor in all these technologies is more the imagination and skill of the user, and less the technologies themselves. Sure, capabilities grow with time, but incredible things are made every day, with very basic tools. - Alex On Tue, Mar 6, 2018 at 5:16 AM, Dave Wade via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic- > > bounces(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> On Behalf Of Herb Johnson > > via vcf-midatlantic > > Sent: 06 March 2018 03:35 > > To: vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org > > > > Cc: Herb Johnson <hjohnson(a)retrotechnology.info> > > Subject: [vcf-midatlantic] About Bill's message > > > > > Creating a library of open-source vintage computing parts * IS * a > > > good idea. Bill: if you'd like to lead the effort then you have my > support. > > > > I agree, it's a good idea. If Bill agrees, I hope he changes the subject > line! hint > > hint > > > > There's a number of toggles that people try to 3D print, varying degrees > of > > success. Maybe keycaps? Light covers? These are small parts and printing > a > > few at a time gives some "scale" to the effort. Tricks like coloring the > plastics > > are good to know. > > > > I think Keycaps are better made with modelling moulding compounds. > > > > Nice thing about collecting models, is that most all 3D printers use the > same > > modeling language. There are some collections of models out there (no > > magic "git" thank goodness) so those could be pointed to. I think I know > a > > few locations .... > > > > I'm not against 3D printers - just skeptical about their results. But > these are > > not a big stretch. And if there's cooperative colleagues among us to > test, we > > can find out! IXR locally also has, or had, a 3D printer > > - Neil can speak to that. Our friend Matt with the $200 printer, can > participate > > too. We might pass the hat to buy plastic noodles... it is OK to call > them that? > > ;) > > The results can be good, but its not just point and shoot. I think where > they really com in is for new prts to adapt old machines. E.g. > > https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1592139 > > Dave > > > > > herb > > > > -- > > Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA > > http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net > > preserve, recover, restore 1970's computing > > email: hjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT com > > or try later herbjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT info > >

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OT: Re: Is it just me or.....
by Herb Johnson 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

> One major difference between the PC and 3DP is the latter will require > substantial materials advancements to make it usefully mainstream and there > doesn't seem to be a Moore's law driving that. That statement, hints at something important. I'm tired of every techie/consumer/science advancement in the last few decades, being compared to the personal computing revolution and to "Moore's Law". Digital technology - almost ALL of it - has advanced in doing THE SAME THING: representing a one or zero with smaller physical hardware. Below the microscopic, it's now below WAVELENGTHS OF LIGHT. OK? Re-read those statements. That's the corollary to Moore's Law. Now: will a 3D printer "advance", by printing pea-sized beer-can openers? Is a 3D printed car a revolution - if it's Hot Wheels sized? So, 3D printing + Moore's Law = zero. Detailed discussion of 3D printing is, as Evan noted, off-topic. But as an engineer, I see that 3D printers have to do more than print plastic forks to be useful to most consumers, and to many techs. But to handle more robust materials, you need more robust tools. A hot tip and a gear to extrude plastic noodles won't get you there. Sorry to those disappointed, but as I said, expectations are too high, the suggested comparison fails. But we vintage computerists, are in the best position, to deny the premise that "3D printing will be the next revolution, like personal computers". We (some of us) know WHY personal computing (and embedded computing) were revolutionary. From an engineering view, 3D printing will be at best, *evolutionary*, like many other advances in technology and materials and processes. Herb Johnson BSEE 1976 -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net preserve, recover, restore 1970's computing email: hjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT com or try later herbjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT info

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About Bill's message
by Herb Johnson 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

> Creating a library of open-source vintage computing parts * IS * a good > idea. Bill: if you'd like to lead the effort then you have my support. I agree, it's a good idea. If Bill agrees, I hope he changes the subject line! hint hint There's a number of toggles that people try to 3D print, varying degrees of success. Maybe keycaps? Light covers? These are small parts and printing a few at a time gives some "scale" to the effort. Tricks like coloring the plastics are good to know. Nice thing about collecting models, is that most all 3D printers use the same modeling language. There are some collections of models out there (no magic "git" thank goodness) so those could be pointed to. I think I know a few locations .... I'm not against 3D printers - just skeptical about their results. But these are not a big stretch. And if there's cooperative colleagues among us to test, we can find out! IXR locally also has, or had, a 3D printer - Neil can speak to that. Our friend Matt with the $200 printer, can participate too. We might pass the hat to buy plastic noodles... it is OK to call them that? ;) herb -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net preserve, recover, restore 1970's computing email: hjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT com or try later herbjohnson AT retrotechnology DOT info

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Connor's famous (again)
by Evan Koblentz 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

Front-and-center on IBM.com right now.

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] About Bill's message
by Dave McGuire 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

You wrote: > I know I've seen 3D printed switches for mini's show up a few times. > Back in 2015, Christopher Parish had a handful of 3D printed > replacement switche paddles for his HP minicomputer. > While I can't put my finger on it, I seem to recall seeing similar > ones for the PDP-8/e but maybe that's a fig newton of my imagination. > Am I remembering this right? (Alex, man, I love ya like a brother, but for the love of God PLEASE fix your mail client) Vince Slyngstad has designed a number of things for the DEC world, including front panel switches: http://so-much-stuff.com/pdp8/cad/3d.php I've printed a few of these with good results. There are three 3D printers here in my lab. I use them with some frequency to make random replacement parts, and quite a lot for customer prototyping applications. I.e., "real work". These are not toys. For all of the assertions in this thread about them being so fiddly, etc, that's really not the case today. These are all Monoprice-branded models (one each of their Mini, Plus, and Ultimate models), and they are essentially plug-and-go, right out of the box. This is not news. I am not a 3D printing "hobbyist" or "hacker". I have enough time-sinks in my life and I do not need or want another. I do, however, need to get work done, which occasionally means making parts, without screwing around, as I have no time to waste. With today's affordable 3D printers this is very much a practical thing, and I do it all the time here with excellent results. Yes, you do need to learn how to use them properly. But the same goes for any tool, even a hammer or a screwdriver. But I would expect a mailing list full of computer people, i.e. thouse with a significantly higher I.Q. than the average slob on the street, should be able to figure that out. Sometimes it's not for work purposes. I messed up my thumb pretty good a few days ago and needed a splint. I found a thumb splint on Thingiverse, and...less than half an hour later, my thumb was in a splint. Nay-say all you want, folks, but it's here. Come see if you don't believe me. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA

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About Bill's message
by Evan Koblentz 06 Mar '18

06 Mar '18

Bill Deg. wrote: >> I keep giving away good ideas and then they're taken without giving me credit The short comment is, "He's right." And that should be rectified. Since day 1 of MARCH -- around fall 2004 -- Bill has been my top adviser. Various MARCH and then VCFed officers have come/gone, but Bill's always been there to give us great ideas and help me understand ways to improve my own ideas. Repair workshops were Bill's idea. (I said they wouldn't succeed.) The holiday party was Bill's idea. (I said nobody would go.) A sales area at VCF East was Bill's idea. (I said it would be too difficult.) Hands-on restorations of the museum items were largely Bill's idea. (I said we couldn't pull it off.) The list goes on... I hope to learn my lesson one of these decades, which is "Listen to Bill." Creating a library of open-source vintage computing parts * IS * a good idea. Bill: if you'd like to lead the effort then you have my support.

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] Mac OS 7.1 Terminal Emulator & BBS software
by Joseph Oprysko 05 Mar '18

05 Mar '18

Oh, my mistake, it’s not 1.5 mb, it’s 8mb. But my hard drive sounds very gummy. Where it’ll slow down and stop spinning occasionally. I haven’t opened it up to see which model hard drive to see if there’s something I can do to clean up the spindle motor/bearings On Sun, Mar 4, 2018 at 3:20 PM Ben Greenfield via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: > > > > On Mar 4, 2018, at 2:29 PM, Dean Notarnicola via vcf-midatlantic < > vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: > > > > I've got 128MB (unofficial maximum) installed in mine. Makes a big > > difference. > > > Wow! I have got to try that, > > > > > > > On Sun, Mar 4, 2018 at 1:42 PM Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic < > > vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: > > > >>> on my SE/30,... (running 7.1) as I only have 1.5mb of Ram. > >> > >> What? An SE/30 has eight 30-pin SIMM slots. Get some 4MB SIMM's! Fill > >> that puppy *up*! - Herb > >> > >> -- > >> Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA > >> http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net > >> > > -- Normal Person: Hey, it seems that you know a lot. Geek: To be honest, it's due to all the surfing I do. Normal Person: So you go surfing? Normal Person: But I don't think that has anything to do with knowing a lot... Geek: I think that's wrong on a fundamental level. Normal Person: Huh? Huh? What?

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Mac OS 7.1 Terminal Emulator & BBS software
by Herb Johnson 04 Mar '18

04 Mar '18

> on my SE/30,... (running 7.1) as I only have 1.5mb of Ram. What? An SE/30 has eight 30-pin SIMM slots. Get some 4MB SIMM's! Fill that puppy *up*! - Herb -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net

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Mac OS 7.1 Terminal Emulator & BBS software
by Joseph Oprysko 04 Mar '18

04 Mar '18

I’m trying to “dial” out on my WiFi232 modem to various Telnet BBS Systems. I currently have Red Ryder as a terminal emulator. On VT100 mode, once it reaches the bottom of the screen it stops scrolling. Any suggestions for software that might work better? Also, I’m considering setting up a BBS on my SE/30, what’s a good BBS package that would work with it (running 7.1) as I only have 1.5mb of Ram. Thanks Joe -- Normal Person: Hey, it seems that you know a lot. Geek: To be honest, it's due to all the surfing I do. Normal Person: So you go surfing? Normal Person: But I don't think that has anything to do with knowing a lot... Geek: I think that's wrong on a fundamental level. Normal Person: Huh? Huh? What?

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] You might wanna read this message :)
by Duane Craps 03 Mar '18

03 Mar '18

On 3/1/2018 7:08 PM, Evan Koblentz via vcf-midatlantic wrote: > Ahem: > http://vcfed.org/wp/festivals/vintage-computer-festival-east/vcf-east-keyno… Yea Bill! No dash in 1219B. Never heard artillery used in reference ti guided missile systems. -- DuaneCraps sdɐɹɔ ǝuɐnp

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Is it just me or.....
by Joseph Oprysko 03 Mar '18

03 Mar '18

The quest for technology appears cyclic. All technologies go through their growing pains. Right now, one of the potentially disruptive consumer technologies is rapid prototyping, more commonly referred to as 3D printing m. 3D Printing in various forms has been a technology used by corporations and in engineering firms for years. The roots of which date back to the early 1980’s. I see the current environment around 3D printing in a consumer aspect appears to closely mimic the growth of the personal computer industry in the 70’s and 80’s. One difference I see is that in the late 70’s and early 80’s, the Open Source movement was also in its infancy, while now, a large share of the hardware and firmware involved in the current growth of 3D Printers embrace open source initiatives. But in contrast, many of the closed source 3D printer manufacturers often appear to have a more consumer friendly product. So this I suppose from a very high level is a good “test” of the open source ideology. Just as many early Linux users and developers thought that the majority of PC’s would be running open source software. (I’m intentionally separating the Personal Computers from mobile devices and infrastructure) While there are a good number of users of open source operating systems, it’s a highly splintered group, with many of the operating systems based on various major distributions of the software and operating system. The open source initiatives have forced the hands a lot of major players in various industries to embrace, or at least utilize openness in parts of their products, sometimes it may be a front end UI, sometimes the firmware or other components. Often there will be a mix of proprietary systems and open source systems to create a device. So, where will the 3D printing industry end up? What is your opinion on this? -- Normal Person: Hey, it seems that you know a lot. Geek: To be honest, it's due to all the surfing I do. Normal Person: So you go surfing? Normal Person: But I don't think that has anything to do with knowing a lot... Geek: I think that's wrong on a fundamental level. Normal Person: Huh? Huh? What?

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[OT] Anyone Interested in an HP 5325a Universal Counter?
by J. Alexander Jacocks 03 Mar '18

03 Mar '18

All, I have an HP 5325a Universal Counter, and the original Manual. The counter is fully functional, and is rather attractive, in my opinion, due to the rugged design combined with the Nicie tube display. I’m bringing it to the workshop, this weekend. Please drop me a note if interested. Thanks! - Alex

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Needed for museum: temporary UPS
by Evan Koblentz 02 Mar '18

02 Mar '18

I'm working with someone at Schneider Electric (which owns the APC brand) to get a small rackmount UPS donated. This is necessary because apparently IA volunteers sometimes turn off the power without any notice. That won't fly if we are running a server. Until we get good one, can someone (preferably someone coming to the workshop tomorrow) bring a small UPS for us to borrow?

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NJ Maker Day (March 10)
by Evan Koblentz 02 Mar '18

02 Mar '18

We were invited to have a table for NJ Maker Day (Saturday, March 10) at the Liberty Science Center. I accepted and I'll bring the Apple II (Laser 128) + Lego robot demo. Can't get enough of that :), it makes our point well, and kids love it! https://lsc.org/explore/today/makers-day I emailed the LSC people to ask if they can give us any extra passes to distribute. Waiting to hear back.

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OT: Re: Is it just me or.....
by Evan Koblentz 02 Mar '18

02 Mar '18

Thread needed OT: subject line prefix. On Mar 2, 2018 12:12 PM, "Joseph Oprysko via vcf-midatlantic" < vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: The quest for technology appears cyclic. All technologies go through their growing pains. Right now, one of the potentially disruptive consumer technologies is rapid prototyping, more commonly referred to as 3D printing m. 3D Printing in various forms has been a technology used by corporations and in engineering firms for years. The roots of which date back to the early 1980’s. I see the current environment around 3D printing in a consumer aspect appears to closely mimic the growth of the personal computer industry in the 70’s and 80’s. One difference I see is that in the late 70’s and early 80’s, the Open Source movement was also in its infancy, while now, a large share of the hardware and firmware involved in the current growth of 3D Printers embrace open source initiatives. But in contrast, many of the closed source 3D printer manufacturers often appear to have a more consumer friendly product. So this I suppose from a very high level is a good “test” of the open source ideology. Just as many early Linux users and developers thought that the majority of PC’s would be running open source software. (I’m intentionally separating the Personal Computers from mobile devices and infrastructure) While there are a good number of users of open source operating systems, it’s a highly splintered group, with many of the operating systems based on various major distributions of the software and operating system. The open source initiatives have forced the hands a lot of major players in various industries to embrace, or at least utilize openness in parts of their products, sometimes it may be a front end UI, sometimes the firmware or other components. Often there will be a mix of proprietary systems and open source systems to create a device. So, where will the 3D printing industry end up? What is your opinion on this? -- Normal Person: Hey, it seems that you know a lot. Geek: To be honest, it's due to all the surfing I do. Normal Person: So you go surfing? Normal Person: But I don't think that has anything to do with knowing a lot... Geek: I think that's wrong on a fundamental level. Normal Person: Huh? Huh? What?

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The important info for the workshop of repair occurring March 3 & 4, 2018
by Jeffrey Brace 02 Mar '18

02 Mar '18

As a reminder the workshop is $10 *per* person, *per* day. Sorry this InfoAge's rule and not our decision. So that means for two days it is $20. Some people didn't realize this last workshop. This has been in effect since June 2017. If you have signed up, then you are guaranteed a table, otherwise you have to beg for forgiveness and bribe me with my favorite snack. DATE: Mar 3 & 4, 2018 LOCATION: InfoAge Building 9032A - (2201 Marconi Road, Wall Township, NJ) TIME: Start about 10 A.M. on Saturday and ends whenever we go to sleep. End about 5 P.M. on Sunday. (Starts around 10 A.M. Sunday morning) SIGNUP: < https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/123vqgOH6iteYwHwLiANXmdSUvZOTEMTArZR… > COST: - $10 per person, PER day. This is required by InfoAge for us to pay for renting the space. - $25 for those wanting to stay overnight. Please pay me when you get there so that I don't forget. Otherwise I will send my attack cat to find you. Seriously, it's a pain to have to chase people around for money. It's not a fun job, but it is necessary because we rent the place from InfoAge and the dorms from the Sandy group. OVERNIGHT: Bring your own pillow, blankets, soap etc. We provide a bed frame and an uncovered mattress. There are showers and a kitchen for your use. - We will have PayPal credit card swipes available. Let me know ahead of time if you want to use this and I will set it up, otherwise it will *not* be available. It takes me time to make sure it located and setup properly. EQUIPMENT: - VCF will provide a table and you can use any available electrical outlet. - Bring your own tools, power strips, power cords, and supplies etc. - Please bring an extra one or two power cords as these are often forgotten by people. DRINKS: You should bring your own. I would recommend bringing a cooler of some type. FOOD: You provide your own. We usually order pizza, subs or go out to a dinner and everyone pays their own way. Usually, we make a decision when everyone gets hungry. GATE: During the hours from 1 pm to 5 pm close the front gate behind you. We want museum visitors to go to the front lobby and not wander through the middle of the campus. Outside of those times, you can feel free to leave the gate open. PARKING: Park across from 9032 or 9010A on any blacktop area. InfoAge doesn't like us parking on the lawn anymore. QUESTIONS? Please ask me (Jeff Brace) or Evan. My cell is 732-759-1783 and Evan’s is 646-546-9999 in case you need to contact us. See everyone there! And have fun! Attachments area

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You might wanna read this message :)
by Evan Koblentz 02 Mar '18

02 Mar '18

Ahem: http://vcfed.org/wp/festivals/vintage-computer-festival-east/vcf-east-keyno…

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Epson QX-10 available in Long Island
by Evan Koblentz 01 Mar '18

01 Mar '18

Got a query through Facebook that a QX-10 is available in Long Island. That's all I know. Email a guy named Ronald: rdyke(a)optonline.net

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AS400 display station (att: Dave McGuire)
by Bill Degnan 01 Mar '18

01 Mar '18

Dave (or anyone with an AS400) Got this message through my site(below); the person has an AS400 display station for sale ( IO 2677D ). I don't know this person. I called and left a message to advise possible interest and to stand by. By coincidence I am heading up to the LSSM this weekend (business in Pittsburgh), I could thus deliver this weekend if you want to make a deal with this guy for it and he is willing to drop off at my house or meet me in Newark at a convenient spot along my travels. If Dave does not want I still get and hold it, but the person who wants it will have to contact the seller and pick it up from me. Dave - I leave noon tomorrow so I'd need it in my hands by then if you want it delivered, so call him directly, etc. Any inquiries, please contact me through my web site. Bill Degnan -------- Original Message -------- > From: ---- > Sent: Thursday, March 1, 2018 12:50 PM > To: ---- > Subject: VintageComputer.net Inquiry > > VintageComputer.net Inquiry Contact Information Name: John Shank > Email: jshank48-at-hotmail.com Phone: 3oh24481175 ------------------------- Comments: > To whom it may concern, > I recently found a older display station, made by a company called IO, still in the box, with all Packaging, I only opened it to see if the Box had been resealed or if it actually was new. Turns out it's brand new, I did some digging online to try to find a model number and I believe what I have is the IO 2677D. I know absolutely nothing about it, I was hoping you might be able to shed some weight. If you would be interested in purchasing it I live about 10 minutes from Landenberg. Thanks for your time > -skip shank > 3oh2-448-1175 > jshank48 -at- hotmail.com VintageComputer.net ---------------------------------------------------------------

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Saturday workshop weather
by Evan Koblentz 01 Mar '18

01 Mar '18

There might be strong winds and rain: http://www.nj.com/weather/index.ssf/2018/02/nj_weather_march_coastal_storm_… But at least it won't snow here.

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Can someone donate an SSD?
by Evan Koblentz 28 Feb '18

28 Feb '18

Everyone, Martin is bringing us a server for the under-construction museum intranet (see specs below). I want to replace its HDD with an SSD. That way it'll be faster and quieter. Can somebody who is attending the workshop this Saturday contribute one, please? Please * do * reply on-list to avoid redundancy. Thanks! -Evan -------- Forwarded Message -------- Evan, Here's what I have: Supermicro SuperServer Atom / SYS-5015A-EHF-D525 - it's the same unit i used for the CDL / IXR firewall and the Diana site firewall. Blowing the crud out of it (dusty) Cut & paste from the website: Intel® Atom™ D525 (DMI) Up to 4GB single channel unbuffered, non-ECC DDR3 800/667MHz SO-DIMM memory 2x Intel 82574L Gigabit LAN 1 PCI-E 2.0 x4 (in x16 slot) Onboard Matrox G200eW video, 1x 3.5-Inch or Up to 2x 2.5-Inch Internal Drives, 200W power supply.

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Selling my Atari VCS (light-sixer)
by Evan Koblentz 28 Feb '18

28 Feb '18

No longer need my VCS. I rarely ever play it, but if I get the itch there are plenty at the museum. I know these are common as dirt. Not sure what it's worth ... light sixer, works fine, average cosmetic condition, bunch of common games (only uncommon game is Spy Hunter), cartridge box holder thingamajig, the usual joysticks/paddles. Please send me a private email if you're interested. ________________________________ Evan Koblentz, executive director Vintage Computer Federation a 501(c)(3) educational non-profit evan(a)vcfed.org (646) 546-9999 www.vcfed.org facebook.com/vcfederation twitter.com/vcfederation instagram.com/vcfederation

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Xerox 820-II for sale, Philly area
by Mike Loewen 28 Feb '18

28 Feb '18

This is NOT my system, but would make a good addition to someone's collection: http://www.vcfed.org/forum/showthread.php?62350-FS-Xerox-820-II-16-8-Comput… Appears to have a working hard drive, and also has the 8086 upgrade board. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Moving and the new place is smaller, so paring down my collection... This one is first, the 3B2 is next! XEROX 820-II COMPUTER - w/ Expansion Box (8"HD / 8" FD), Software, and More Click image for larger version. Name: 20180227_205338.jpg Views: 13 Size: 96.8 KB ID: 44027 Just fired it up and it works. Booted CP/M 80 form the HD... It has the 16 bit "upgrade" (8086) and comes with MS-DOS 2 and CP/M-86 on 8" FD (untested). This sucka is HEAVY so probably needs to be picked up - local to Philadelphia, PA (Delaware County Suburbs) Posting here and one other site; wanted to give y'all first crack. MAKE OFFER via P/M.

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Urgent -- workshop, etc.
by Evan Koblentz 27 Feb '18

27 Feb '18

Guys, Jeff B. is taking leave from our group until the end of March so he can focus on a personal matter. He has our full support. (Don't worry, it is not health-related.) Please do NOT bug him with anything related to vintage computing. That includes all of his responsibilities with the group -- workshops, docenting, etc. -- contact me instead. He'll re-join us in April for the pleasures of VCF East XIII. Thanks, Evan

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Micros available to good homes
by Evan Koblentz 27 Feb '18

27 Feb '18

See below. Contact him directly off-list. He lives in Perkasie PA. -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: More donations for VCF Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2018 07:45:26 -0500 From: Alfred Poor <apoor(a)verizon.net> To: evan(a)vcfed.org Evan, our home of 30+ years is under contract, and I’m clearing out my office. I’ve got a lot of items that might be of interest to VCF, including a Kaypro II, a Compaq, a TRS-80 Model 100, IBM XT, IBM AT, and Dell 310. I’ve also selected some of my favorite reference books which could be helpful in keeping these things running, including the three-volume technical manuals for the IBM AT. I also have copies of Windows ME, Windows 2000, and other operating systems.

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Needed for museum: locker with shelves
by Evan Koblentz 27 Feb '18

27 Feb '18

We have a locker in the museum workshop. Standard 6 ft. tall, ugly, closes with a padlock. It's about a foot wide. It fits nicely into our available space, but it is relatively useless because it only has one shelf up top and there's no easy way to add more shelves I want to get rid of it and replace it with a similar unit (black or gray) but the kind that has several shelves from top to bottom. Anybody have one? Or can someone look online and find us one cheap that's within a reasonable drive for us to go get?

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eBay Damage
by Chris Fala 26 Feb '18

26 Feb '18

I have WAY too many horribly sad stories about shipping damage. I have tried to suggest to sellers to pack carefully. Sometimes they do OK, sometimes they fail miserably, and sometimes they get angry and offended that I dare tell them how to do anything. I wish there was a fool-proof solution (other than local pickup which isn't always an option). On Feb 24, 2018, at 1:49 PM, John Heritage via vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: And I need to vent a little further. This was in good shape before the seller didn't pack it properly :(. Anyway, thanks for listening fellow retro enthusiasts :) John On Sat, Feb 24, 2018 at 1:46 PM, John Heritage <john.heritage(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Folks, > > I'm still on the lookout for an Atari 810 drive to match my Atari 800 > computers. There are two types -- one with a 'barn door' that opens up, > and another with the middle flip lid. I want the middle flip lid type. > > I just ordered one on Ebay and of course the guy packaged it horribly, so > the case became heavily damaged so now I have deal with returning it. :(. > > Anyway, It doesn't have to work perfectly I just something for > nostalgia/collection sake. > > I have cash and 1050 drives to trade if appropriate. > > Thank you! > John >

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Museum upgrade :)
by Evan Koblentz 26 Feb '18

26 Feb '18

Sent the museum report just now and forgot to mention something important! Jeff B. got us a very nice new chair for the staff PC in the museum workshop. $200 chair which he found on sale for $60. We dumped the old blue one.

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Museum report
by Evan Koblentz 26 Feb '18

26 Feb '18

Super busy day. Pete was our docent. Moderate number of visistors today. Tony spent a couple of more hours working on Apple IIs. Chris L., his s/o Kim, and Brian C. were surprise visitors. Adam, me, Pete's son Alex, and a new volunteer Laura did warehouse projects. Here's what we got done in the warehouse: - Put all three of the old but still useful long display cases in one spot - Organized and consolidated the OS/2 collection - Put aside seven of our luggables for sale at VCF East (three Compaq, three Kaypro, one Osborne) - Moved the rack of IBM 1130 punch cards to be with the other punch cards + create space in the IBM aisle - Moved two AS/400s from the unsorted area into the IBM aisle - Sorted (and put duplicates aside to sell) of Atari, Coleco, Intellivision, and Odyssey cartridges - Started working on a plan for what to do next time we're here

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OT: How to store old ICs?
by John Heritage 25 Feb '18

25 Feb '18

Hi folks, A "noob" question -- I have some old ICs -- custom chips, RAM, etc.. that I'd like to properly store. Is storing these in antistatic foam and in a (3D printed) plastic drawer of some kind OK? should i be buying/using IC Chip tubes instead? What's the best way to get reasonably priced supplies for safely storing vintage chips? Thanks! John

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Museum Report 2018-02-24 February 24, 2018
by Jeffrey Brace 25 Feb '18

25 Feb '18

Tony was at the museum from about 1pm to 4pm. Surprisingly Bill Dromgoole was already here! I arrived around 3pm stayed until 5pm. Dromgoole worked on the Univac some more. Did some memory testing. He took out a fan is going to work on it at home to repair. He will be back next weekend for the workshop. Tony did docenting and worked on repairing VCF apple machines. I talked with them and VCF member visitors Don Caselli and Nick Lordi. There was an InfoAge talk given with about 100 people in attendance. It was Alice Bowman NASA operations manager. About a dozen visitors throughout the course of the day. Evan, Adam, and Pete will be at VCF tomorrow. == Jeff Brace

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Be a docent at the next workshop mar 3 and/or 4, 2018
by Jeffrey Brace 24 Feb '18

24 Feb '18

For those attending next weekends workshop we have a signup list. We just want one hour per person to share the load and have lots of fun! Signup here: < https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uJklCb5HcA1c1uKQFVCSLcHhxzhKTiFQhfu… >

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OT: Looking for Atari 810 Drive
by John Heritage 24 Feb '18

24 Feb '18

Hi Folks, I'm still on the lookout for an Atari 810 drive to match my Atari 800 computers. There are two types -- one with a 'barn door' that opens up, and another with the middle flip lid. I want the middle flip lid type. I just ordered one on Ebay and of course the guy packaged it horribly, so the case became heavily damaged so now I have deal with returning it. :(. Anyway, It doesn't have to work perfectly I just something for nostalgia/collection sake. I have cash and 1050 drives to trade if appropriate. Thank you! John

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Another Microcomputer?
by Peter Cetinski 24 Feb '18

24 Feb '18

Just throwing this out there based on Evan’s other thread about the NeXT. And I am sure this will come as no surprise to many of you. If there is room for another microcomputer in the museum, after the NeXT, I would like to nominate the TRS-80 8” business machine, ie. Model II/12/16/16B/6000. This was a significant machine in the small to medium business microcomputer market during the first half of the 80s. For awhile, the Model 16B running XENIX was the most popular Unix based workstation on the market. The Model II was reviewed as superior to the IBM PC when the 5150 was released in 1981. The MC68000 subsystem introduced in the Model 16 made for a very fascinating dual CPU microcomputer architecture. There are a lot of Apples currently on display but only one TRS-80 on display. :) I would certainly volunteer to help restore one of the museum’s 8” TRS-80s machines for display. I know a few others on this list who have experience with these machines that would also help, I’m sure. Thanks Pete

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