April 2019 - vcf-midatlantic

5965 tubes
by Sentrytv 13 Apr '19

13 Apr '19

Found some NOS 5965 tubes in a lot of tubes I purchased Are these needed by anyone in the group? Mike Rosen Sent from: My extremely complicated, hand held electronic device.

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Hard drive art
by Herb Johnson 13 Apr '19

13 Apr '19

Brian Brubaker posts about use of hard-drive parts to create art, for our appreciation. Well, this use of vintage electronics as art, gives me pause. I thought about it; I wrote a lecture; I decided a lecture would not be read or appreciated. So here's my straightforward considerations. Brian: I restore vintage computers to operation. So I see in parts of your art, computers that can't be restored because they were demolished. That's not an abstraction, for me - that is a fact. This situation is not your fault. However, you have posted in a group of vintage-computer restorers; so my point is relevant in this forum. So: Brian, I encourage you to make available, such ancient drives and parts as might be useful to restore ancient computers. I'm sure you can get guidance about doing so. I don't mean to spoil your fun or interests. Do not go back to "lurking" because some old-guy doesn't like your work - that is not what I said, that's not how I said it. Art evokes responses; the artist can't determine all those responses. This is part of my response. And certainly, there's art today which is FAR more controversial than a bunch of old computer parts. I'm making a point, not cursing your works, which have artistic merit. Brian, thanks for showing your works in this forum. Herb Johnson -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net

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Hackaday - Paper Tape Reader Badge
by Neil Cherry 12 Apr '19

12 Apr '19

I've only skimmed this https://hackaday.com/2019/04/12/cyphercon-badge-has-a-paper-tape-reader-bui… Now I wonder if I can get that to talk to my PiDP8? PS: I skimmed because I have about 2 minutes between calls and Qs. I might actually get to read it this weekend. :( -- Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry ncherry(a)linuxha.com http://www.linuxha.com/ Main site http://linuxha.blogspot.com/ My HA Blog Author of: Linux Smart Homes For Dummies

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] MOS LSI chips time frame
by Evan Koblentz 12 Apr '19

12 Apr '19

Ben, Sorry if I already ask you this: are you planning to exhibit at VCF East again? Or at least to attend? If you're exhibiting, then we need you to register by this Saturday at 11:59pm. Hard deadline. Running joke: still got hoodies and Legos with your name on it. It's time to rectify that.... -- Evan Koblentz, executive director Vintage Computer Federation www.vcfed.org evan(a)vcfed.org (646) 546-9999 VCF is a 501(c)(3) non-profit organization.

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] MOS LSI chips time frame
by Ben Greenfield 11 Apr '19

11 Apr '19

Hello Herb, Thanks for the framing. My follow-up email should have 2 links one from a paper written by C.F. O’Donnel and presented at the Fall Joint Computer Conference, 1968 This paper describe the fabrication process and the obvious need for computer assisted design to manage the complexity of the masks. It describes moving the manual process they were using pre-MOS-LSI to computer process. An excellent paper. The second link was to this paper written by Ken Shirriff discussing intel and the first microprocessor. This paper is also a good read. Which touches on the Autonetics D200 https://spectrum.ieee.org/tech-history/silicon-revolution/the-surprising-st… I have now found a second paper presented at the Fall Joint Computer Conference, 1968 this one by R.K. Booher Describing autonetics sudy of potential and the problems associated with direct coupled and 2-pahse MOS circuits and devised the 4-phase system which solved many problems. https://www.computer.org/csdl/pds/api/csdl/proceedings/download-article/507… > On Apr 11, 2019, at 3:24 PM, Herb Johnson via vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vcfed.org> wrote: > > > From: Herb Johnson <hjohnson(a)retrotechnology.info> > Subject: [vcf-midatlantic] MOS LSI chips time frame > Date: April 11, 2019 at 3:24:38 PM EDT > To: vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vcfed.org> > > > Ben Greenfield posted: "I’m doing some research on North American Aviation/Autonetics artifacts and while researching simply Metal Oxide Semiconductor or MOS." > > He pointed to some photos of some NAA objects with labels "Autonetics MOS/SOS" from Rockwell/Autonetics. Apparent dates 1968 or so. > > My interest is in COSMOS products from RCA, particularly the 1802 COSMAC microprocessor. A Web search of my site will be informative about that. > > RCA produced an LSI chip-pair version later known as the 1801, sometime in 1975; followed by the 1802 single-chip. But RCA produced SOS (Silicon on Sapphire) COS (complimentary silicon) logic in the early 1970's and possibly earlier. > > I've not traced the history of RCA's CMOS work but it's likely of the same era as the Autonetics/Rockwell work. Ben, I don't know your goals or interests. But if I were researching this, I'd look back at the electronic trade journals and the IEEE conference journals of the period. Those would have names and dates and products and prototypes and functionality. > > I'd like to be told, if RCA's CMOS work was preceded by work from Rockwell slash Autonetics; or if there's some relationship. > > Another subtext appears to be "the first microprocessor". I'm not overly interested in arguing "firsts", or arguing ABOUT arguing "firsts". The RCA COSMAC 1802 is interesting for many reasons. > > herb johnson > > > -- > Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA > http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net > > >

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MOS LSI chips time frame
by Herb Johnson 11 Apr '19

11 Apr '19

Ben Greenfield posted: "I’m doing some research on North American Aviation/Autonetics artifacts and while researching simply Metal Oxide Semiconductor or MOS." He pointed to some photos of some NAA objects with labels "Autonetics MOS/SOS" from Rockwell/Autonetics. Apparent dates 1968 or so. My interest is in COSMOS products from RCA, particularly the 1802 COSMAC microprocessor. A Web search of my site will be informative about that. RCA produced an LSI chip-pair version later known as the 1801, sometime in 1975; followed by the 1802 single-chip. But RCA produced SOS (Silicon on Sapphire) COS (complimentary silicon) logic in the early 1970's and possibly earlier. I've not traced the history of RCA's CMOS work but it's likely of the same era as the Autonetics/Rockwell work. Ben, I don't know your goals or interests. But if I were researching this, I'd look back at the electronic trade journals and the IEEE conference journals of the period. Those would have names and dates and products and prototypes and functionality. I'd like to be told, if RCA's CMOS work was preceded by work from Rockwell slash Autonetics; or if there's some relationship. Another subtext appears to be "the first microprocessor". I'm not overly interested in arguing "firsts", or arguing ABOUT arguing "firsts". The RCA COSMAC 1802 is interesting for many reasons. herb johnson -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey in the USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net

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museum report
by Evan Koblentz 10 Apr '19

10 Apr '19

Productive day at the museum today. - Big group of local high school students visited for a thorough tour - Senior citizen's group also visited for a tour - Steve A. stopped by to relocate our new(er) access point onto the ceiling, replacing the old(er) Cisco unit - I ordered the table rental for VCF East -- Evan Koblentz, executive director Vintage Computer Federation www.vcfed.org evan(a)vcfed.org (646) 546-9999 VCF is a 501(c)(3) non-profit organization.

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] MOS LSI chips time frame
by Ben Greenfield 10 Apr '19

10 Apr '19

To answer my own question MOS-LSI process was a big jump in processing power. The integrated circuit as the main building block for complex systems could manage about 30 elements where this new process jumped to between 600 to 6000 elements on a chip. If that sounds wrong to anyone I grabbed it from this paper which actually describes the process change in the context of trying to produce an Autonetics D200. https://www.computer.org/csdl/pds/api/csdl/proceedings/download-article/507… <https://www.computer.org/csdl/pds/api/csdl/proceedings/download-article/507…> I also found this reference The Surprising Story of the First Microprocessors - IEEE Spectrum <https://spectrum.ieee.org/tech-history/silicon-revolution/the-surprising-st…> Sorry about the use of First in the head line… So far those have been the best sources of information on this process and the Autonetics D200. What I find interesting is that I’m starting to suppose that Silicon Valley is really the home of personal computing and venture capital but it is far from the center of technology. Hope someone finds this interesting, Ben > On Feb 26, 2019, at 8:08 AM, Ben Greenfield via vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vcfed.org> wrote: > > > From: Ben Greenfield <ben(a)cogs.com> > Subject: MOS LSI chips time frame > Date: February 26, 2019 at 8:08:03 AM EST > To: vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vcfed.org> > > > Hey All, > > I’m doing some research on North American Aviation/Autonetics artifacts and while researching simply Metal Oxide Semiconductor or MOS. > > Here are some image artifacts > > https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/#B0YG4TcsmGWIVSf <https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/#B0YG4TcsmGWIVSf> > > So the text on the back of the sales package clearly references anticipating the possibilities 1968 will bring. > > I was searching MOS LSI and of course I find exhibit “A” for the problems of claiming first in technology development. > > http://firstmicroprocessor.com > > I was hoping some one could comment on the development of MOS processeses in general to give me context. > > I also wanted to share what I think are some pretty cool artifacts. > > Thanks, > > Ben > > > > > >

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Workshop Info Important VCF Repair & Signup April 13 & 14, 2019
by Jeffrey Brace 09 Apr '19

09 Apr '19

As a reminder the workshop is $10 *per* person, *per* day. Sorry this is InfoAge's rule and not our decision. So that means for two days it is $20. Sign up quickly to guarantee a table. DATE: April 13 & 14, 2019 LOCATION: InfoAge Building 9032A - (2201 Marconi Road, Wall Township, NJ) TIME: Start about 10 A.M. on Saturday and ends whenever we go to sleep. End about 5 P.M. on Sunday. (Starts around 10 A.M. Sunday morning) SIGNUP: < https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1XTEGeYkzqrmGL_X5OdyFbjoy4QtLMBDoX5r… > COST: - $10 per person, PER day. This is required by InfoAge for us to pay for renting the space. - $25 for those wanting to stay overnight (Money goes to InfoAge). Please pay me when you get there so that I don't forget and then have to spend time chasing you down. Credit cards accepted. I will be using VCF's PayPal Here tablet with bluetooth credit card machine. OVERNIGHT: Bring your own pillow, blankets, soap etc. We provide a bed frame and an uncovered mattress. There are showers and a kitchen for your use. - You can pay via PayPal to paypal(a)vcfed.org. or to me via cash or credit card in person. EQUIPMENT: - VCF will provide a table and you can use any available electrical outlet. - Bring your own tools, power strips, power cords, and supplies etc. - If you need particular tools that you don't know or particular parts, please post to the list for those going. They may have what you need. Let them know ahead of time. - Please bring an extra one or two power cords as these are often forgotten by people. DRINKS: You should bring your own. I would recommend bringing a cooler of some type. FOOD: You provide your own. We usually order pizza, subs or go out to a dinner and everyone pays their own way. Usually, we make a decision when everyone gets hungry. GATE: During the hours from 1 pm to 5 pm close the front gate behind you. We want museum visitors to go to the front lobby and not wander through the middle of the campus. Outside of those times, you can feel free to leave the gate open. PARKING: Park across from 9032 or 9010A on any blacktop area. InfoAge doesn't like us parking on the lawn anymore. QUESTIONS? Contact Evan : 646-546-9999 or evan(a)vcfed.org or myself (Jeff) : 732-759-1783 or jeffrey(a)vcfed.org Have fun everyone! -- ========================================= Jeff Brace Vice President Vintage Computer Federation

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] Unix demo @ Bell Labs - June 5
by Lou 09 Apr '19

09 Apr '19

Oh man if there is any way I can be part of this please, please let me know. I might even have a wonderful system for such an exhibit coming my way soon.

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