- vcf-midatlantic - lists.vcfed.org

XT-IDE rev 3 Boards Have Shipped!
by Systems Glitch 13 Jun '16

13 Jun '16

Just received an email alert that the run of XT-IDE rev 3 boards have shipped from PCBCart in China. They're coming DHL, which is usually 2-3 days China -> Here. Thanks, Jonathan

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Workshop
by Evan Koblentz 13 Jun '16

13 Jun '16

Everyone ready for the workshop tomorrow? We're starting at 10am. I'll bring doughnuts.

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books about robots
by Evan Koblentz 12 Jun '16

12 Jun '16

Remember last week we discussed books about robots in the HOPE thread? Both books arrived today. One of them, "How to design & build your own custom robot" by David Heiserman, is very deep -- heavy reading. The other, "How to build a computer-controlled robot" by Tod Loofbourrow, contains a reasonable project that we as a group can build (but not in time for HOPE unless we really bust ass.) In the preface of Loofbourrow's book, he wrote: "I want to thank the members of the Amateur Computer Group of New Jersey, whose suggestions have helped make Mike (that's what he calls the robot -EK) what he is today." Googled the author. He went on to a nice career in robotics. I sent him an intro tweet via our official VCFed account. Apparently he lives in the Boston area. Maybe we can get him down to the museum for a talk one day.

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books about robots
by Herb Johnson 12 Jun '16

12 Jun '16

The local to me College of NJ library has copies of "How to design" by Heiserman and "How to build" by Loofbourrow. I read them and they are both interesting and useful as vintage how-to robotics books. Heiserman is pre-microprocessor so it's pure TTL digital logic. It's informative about digital methods. Loofbourrow covers a lot of mechanics on joints, hands; and has lots of KIM 6502 code. Both books, and others of that late 1970's era, are good on how to make mechanical stuff from available materials - wood, metal, etc. To make robotics from stuff on hand, not stuff you buy for that use. And they lay out the logic and often the code for managing sensors and actuators; stuff that's often buried in support code today. It's informative and educational to see these things at a fundamental level. HErb -- Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA http://www.retrotechnology.com OR .net

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] Happiness is...
by Jason Perkins 12 Jun '16

12 Jun '16

If you guys need a pbx I have an AT&T partner I've been trying to get rid of. Jason Perkins 313 355.0085 Sent from my Kindle On June 12, 2016, at 2:16 PM, Jim Scheef via vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: Mike, It would be very cool if people could bring appropriate devices - say a Tandy M100 - and "dial" into the BBS onsite. Jim -----Original Message----- From: vcf-midatlantic [mailto:vcf-midatlantic-bounces@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org] On Behalf Of Mike Loewen via vcf-midatlantic Sent: Thursday, June 9, 2016 1:13 AM To: vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org Cc: Mike Loewen <mloewen(a)cpumagic.scol.pa.us> Subject: [vcf-midatlantic] Happiness is... ...powering up a Tandy 6000HD which hasn't been run for at least 2 years, and having it boot right up to Xenix 3.2! I'm thinking of exhibiting it at VCF Midwest with my 1986 BBS software. Mike Loewen mloewen(a)cpumagic.scol.pa.us Old Technology http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

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A neat way to support VCFed
by Evan Koblentz 12 Jun '16

12 Jun '16

Now that eBay knows we're a legitimate charity, anyone can post a listing and specify that X percent of the sale should be given to us. Check it out: http://charity.ebay.com/charity-auctions/charity/vintage-computer-federatio….

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Workshop breakfast tomorrow
by Evan Koblentz 12 Jun '16

12 Jun '16

For anybody who didn't stay here tonight or who is arriving tomorrow: we will meet for breakfast at the Princess Maria Dinner (on Rt. 35 in Wall Township) at 9:00am. Probably back at the museum around 10:30ish.

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"floppy drive pot luck" at the June workshop?
by Steven Michelsen 10 Jun '16

10 Jun '16

I am planning to come to the June workshop this weekend, in the hopes that someone can help me diagnose my smokin' hot (literally) Eagle PC. I found a seller on ebay who is local to me, that just sold a lot of 5.25" floppy drives for $7 each. He has 13 more of them that he was planning to put up for auction. He says that they were all pulled from PCs on their way to recycling, and they have not been tested. They are all half-height drives. He is willing to sell me the pile for $6 each. I will pick up the other 13 drives if enough folks who will be at the event this weekend are willing to put up $6 each for one or more of them. I will keep a few myself; there will be about 10 up for grabs. Who's in? The seller has given me a day to gauge your interest in this stuff. If this email violates some sort of "no commerce" mandate, I apologize. I am not looking to make anything on all this; just looking to share what seems like a good deal. Steve

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Re: [vcf-midatlantic] "floppy drive pot luck" at the June workshop
by Steven Michelsen 10 Jun '16

10 Jun '16

OK I just bought the lot. Whatever is left over I can always keep or put up on ebay. I hope to be there tomorrow 1pm or so. Steve -----Original Message----- From: vcf-midatlantic [mailto:vcf-midatlantic-bounces@lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org] On Behalf Of Dean Notarnicola via vcf-midatlantic Sent: Friday, June 10, 2016 3:38 PM To: vcf-midatlantic <vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> Cc: Dean Notarnicola <dnotarnicola(a)gmail.com> Subject: Re: [vcf-midatlantic] "floppy drive pot luck" at the June workshop? I'll take at least one; more if they are 360K On Friday, June 10, 2016, william degnan via vcf-midatlantic < vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org> wrote: > Steve, > That's very on-topic, thanks for the suggestion. Hopefully someone > will want them b > > On Fri, Jun 10, 2016 at 3:18 PM, Steven Michelsen via vcf-midatlantic > < vcf-midatlantic(a)lists.vintagecomputerfederation.org <javascript:;>> wrote: > > > I am planning to come to the June workshop this weekend, in the > > hopes > that > > someone can help me diagnose my smokin' hot (literally) Eagle PC. > > > > > > > > I found a seller on ebay who is local to me, that just sold a lot of > 5.25" > > floppy drives for $7 each. He has 13 more of them that he was > > planning > to > > put up for auction. He says that they were all pulled from PCs on their > > way to recycling, and they have not been tested. They are all > half-height > > drives. He is willing to sell me the pile for $6 each. > > > > > > > > I will pick up the other 13 drives if enough folks who will be at > > the > event > > this weekend are willing to put up $6 each for one or more of them. I > > will > > keep a few myself; there will be about 10 up for grabs. Who's in? The > > seller has given me a day to gauge your interest in this stuff. > > > > > > > > If this email violates some sort of "no commerce" mandate, I apologize. > I > > am not looking to make anything on all this; just looking to share > > what seems like a good deal. > > > > > > > > Steve > > > > > > > -- > @ BillDeg: > Web: vintagecomputer.net > Twitter: @billdeg <https://twitter.com/billdeg> > Youtube: @billdeg <https://www.youtube.com/user/billdeg> > Unauthorized Bio <http://www.vintagecomputer.net/readme.cfm> >

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bunch-o-replies
by Jeffrey Jonas 10 Jun '16

10 Jun '16

I get the digest version so I'm replying to everything I just read: From: VAXman(a)tmesis.org > Also, the GUI -- guarantee user ignorance That's a good one *ker-quote* *** Neil Cherry: > I really see no merit to teaching some programming lingo > but I do see merit in developing a logical/programming mindset > to get from point A (input) the point B (output). I misread that as "from port A input to port B output". But I'll make my point anyway: even BASIC had PEEK and POKE for hardware specific twiddling. Most Apple ][ folks had the Beagle Brothers posters and cheat-sheets for hardware specific tweaks and configurations. Now it's all an "app" or utility. No understanding required. *** Bill Sudbrink: > We get job candidates with CS degrees from reputable universities > who don't know what a register is I'm still wrestling with how to explain "what is a register" without using the word "register". Saying it's "special memory" doesn't convey how it's so different from RAM or ROM. *** Dean Notarnicola > ... I knew plenty of Cobol programmers back in the day > who knew practically zero about how or why the underlying systems worked. My dad worked on mainframes since the 50s. Cobol was his bread-and-butter but he also had to know peripheral specifics to make them sing and dance. He still remembers details of the Analex printer required to make it work at full tilt because printing labels was one of his assignments. Things people proudly claim as "hacks" were just common requirements of the job "back then". My dad knew machine code and assemblers. He has reference cards for Autocoder and other ancient tongues because before source code debuggers, all you got was a core dump and the error exception. IBM mainframes gave an ABEND code, register dump and a core dump. The programmer manually figured out what instruction gave the error, crawling around the data segment as required to figure the full context. Huge tables were often covered in fanfold to trace all the pieces. *** chrisjpf33(a)gmail.com > And that is why we have garbage software today! Thus Java: write once, debug everywhere. I've seen embedded crapware, such as a Dlink home router that emitted the most horrendous HTML it was my displeasure to view. Despite claiming "Linux compatible", some administrative menus were IE only, as if the firmware was created by someone using M$ building blocks. *** re: not learning what's under the hood I'm kinda guilty-as-charged. I had an assignment on IBM system 3 where I took a black-box lego-building-block approach since time was limited. I learned RPG, OCL (the system's primitive JCL) and the system utilities. Everything required for program development and machine administration, but never got deeper into the machine architecture. McGuire's ribbed me for that since it's a wonderful machine. I don't think the client would've appreciated my frobbing the CE panel :-) I made up for that by learning the Z80 and IBM 1130. *** Evan: > I'd be interested in seeing how the percentage of college freshman > choosing the EE major changes over time for the past few decades. And what constitutes an EE major now vs. 'then'? I'm not up to date on ABET accreditation but degree requirements are a moving target. I had just missed learning tubes and using a slide rule. The motor/generator lab was abandoned only a few years earlier because nobody taught it. The curriculum emphasized math, solid state physics and silicon devices. Interdisciplinary engineering is now not only tolerated but encouraged. Simulation tools such as MATLAB are considered essential foundations. Today's EE degree is quite different from that of only a few years ago. As Christopher Blackmon already replied: > The college I went to (NC State Univ) > offers a CPE (Computer Engineering) degree that (at least was) > a simple hybrid of CSC & EE re: Storage is basically free now. Not when you're using a system-on-chip such as the Arduino. The popular AT-Tiny takes everything several steps smaller. *** re: Tony Bogan > 99% of the people never have and never will > know how to fix a car, or even a bike. I'm forced to agree, kinda. A 3 speed bike was my primary vehicle for many years, with daily use for a paper route. I changed snapped cables, flats, snapped chains but never had to dig into the shifter. It's reminiscent of the Monty Python "Bicycle Repairman" skit where a town of all superheroes have no such basic skills. Just consider how many folks cannot even change a car tire, depending entirely on roadside service. When it's available quickly, okay, it's nice. But there are times and places you're out of range. And then what? -- jeff jonas

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